If I told you that a 19 year old man was arrested Sunday night for singing a rap song which contained profanity would you believe me?
Well its true. Seems that a woman complained that the man kept repeating the words "mother fucker" which apparently was a necessary part of the rap song he was singing at the time. A song which can be found on the album, Bad Azz, by Louisiana rapper, Lil Boosie. Oh, Lil Boosie also has classics like "Fuck You", and "My Nigga" on his masterpiece of an album. (Move over Tupac and Biggie). The reason the woman said she complained is because her two sons, who are four and fifteen respectively, happened to be within earshot at the time.
Here is a picture of the young man.
Does seeing the young man's picture change your mind about how you felt before?
The libertarian streak in me wants to say that this lady should get a life. I am sure her fifteen year old hears worse things in school every damn day. But the human being in me also says that you have to respect other people as well. You are not on this planet alone. You just can't go walking down the street and dropping the "F" bomb whenver you feel like it, and loud enough for children to hear.
I am thinking that the next time home boy should just practice his rapping skills at home, or maybe find a different rapper to idolize.
His race isn't the issue, but yes, on the Metro (subway) here I am apalled at the language our mothers, kids, young men use in earshot of small children. I sound like a little old lady, but damn it--when you're sitting there reading, talking to a three year old and a bunch of little hoodlum wannabees jump on the train and and it's muthafucka this and nigga that--and these are the girls by the way--then what to do?
ReplyDeleteHome training. It's not just for bourgie kids. It's for all of us. Except Monique Braxton...
Lock him up for a while in the county jail. My Nigga might teach him some things.
ReplyDeleteBy the way Field--
ReplyDeletePhilly booster and my girl LA Banks is up for an Essence Lit. Award--so root for her...
I guess in the state of Florida and in the Bush era, the 19 year old "motherfucker" doesn't have any First Amendment rights.
ReplyDeleteIn 2003, in Albany, NY, a father and son went shopping at a mall. The trip ended with the father arrested and in handcuffs.
The crime? The father and son had bought anti-war t-shirts at the mall. The shirts read "Give Peace a Chance" and "Peace on Earth and "Let Inspections Work" and "No War With Iraq."
After buying the t-shirts. They put them on. And went to eat in the food court. That’s when a mall security guard approach the two and requested they remove the shirts. Stephen said no. The mall called the police. And soon the father was in handcuffs.
This is George Bush's Murika.
I have been reading your blog for a while now, and I like what I have seen so far.
ReplyDeleteI am kind of on the fence with this one. I agree that it is wrong to use profanity in the presence of women or children. I myself gave up the use of profanity for my own reasons. However, who am I to tell any man/woman how to talk? So yeah I think the guy was rude, but I also think when people act like that, it is more tacky than anything close to breaking the law. I agree with you FN and Christopher, it is all about home training and you should respect others. If this is going to be the case we can all be charged and arrested for offending someone.
The more you restrict language the more power you give it.
ReplyDeleteI was in my mass communication law class the other day, and we were talking about the law regarding obscenity/indecency/profanity. My prof used the S-word over and over, and we all giggled each time. Then she asked us why we giggled. Is it because you were told to not say these words when you were growing up? (Obviously, yes) Then she said we'll probably be giggling for the rest of our lives just because we were taught it was a taboo...
And it wasn't the first time those kids heard those words, and I'm sure they've used it. And, most importantly, they will undergo no "damage" from hearing them.
And here's a good question: will this mom complain if her sons get arrested for the same thing in a couple of years?
This is all about a failure to see the bigger picture.
I think that the woman is in the wrong. This is supposed to be a free country. While he shouldn't have been doing it around kids, he shouldn't have been arrested.
ReplyDelete@Christopher:
ReplyDeleteThat’s when a mall security guard approach the two and requested they remove the shirts. Stephen said no. The mall called the police. And soon the father was in handcuffs.
It's a wonder that the police didn't arrest everyone associated with the store for selling these obviously obscene t-shirts.
Surely, the man and his son sued the mall for this infringement on their civil rights.
As a long time construction worker I can swear with the best of them. At some point you have to get a clue about when and where you can use this language. My old man clued me in with the back of his hand on this topic.
ReplyDeleteI feel bad since the kid is obviously lacking any moral guidance and now resides in a cell. That seems a bit extreme for swearing.
The right to free speech is fine, but at some point your free speech must have limits. We all, as adults, have lines that can't be crossed whether social or work related. To cross them usually results in some form of punishment.
Christopher Chamber:Philly booster and my girl LA Banks is up for an Essence Lit. Award--so root for her
ReplyDeleteThanks for the info. LA Banks is one of my favorite authors. I love her Vampire Huntress series. I hope she wins.
Sorry I'm off topic yall.lol
As for the wannabe rapper, they're everywhere so she should get used to it. I,m sure her children are already.
There is no fense for me, LOCK HIM UP. It didn't matter what his ethnic makeup was. If you are offending me with your "art" in public I have a right to challenge that "art" if it violates a quality of life concern.
ReplyDeleteI don't believe in censorship BUT their is a time and an established place for certain types of "art" as well as speech. This kid violated that Constitutional Trust. I am quite sure that the CD the song came from also had an ADULT CONTENT lable on it which mean it is for ADULT EARS. This is the same as buying a XXX Video and setting up a Big Screen Television on your fromt lawn and showing it to anyone who come by.
If this kid wants to rap X-rated lyrics, he needs to find a non-public place to do it.
Christopher, as to your MALL incident, BIG DIFFERENCE, the Mall guards were just being ASSHOLES and the man and his son was in their right to NOT take off their T-Shirts. I would put money on it ALL CHARGES where dropped.
Oh come on! This is another case of Law Enforcement Gone Wild!
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry if the First Amendment is offensive to some people, but too bad.
He did nothing overtly wrong and it wouldn't surprise me if the ACLU came to this man's defense.
1) It's not porn.
2) It's not even his words; he's singing someone else's song.
3) This is a slippery slope case. If you send him to jail, you might as well send George Carlin, Chris Tucker, and Chris Rock to jail, because their acts produce far more profanities than this guy uttered from 1 song.
4) If he has to go to jail, then why are Michael Savage, Neil Boortz, Rush Limbaugh, Laura Ingraham, Sean Hannity, and Bill O'Reilly still free? Their radio and TV shows are 1000% more (racially) offensive and pornographic than Lil' Bossie ever can be.
If all he gets is a ticket, then that would be fine by me.
A 43-year-old Issaquah, WA school bus driver was fired in September, 2006 after he dared to flip-off President George W. Bush during his visit to Washington.
ReplyDeleteBush was in town to campaign for Rep. Dave Reichert. The two were traveling in a limo headed for a fundraiser when they passed several school buses full of students.
The students waved to the president, and while waving back Bush turned to Reichert and said the driver of one of the buses flipped him off.
A week later when Reichert called the Issaquah School District to report the incident he learned that the district was aware of the driver's action and was investigating.
We're headed down a slippery slope, folks. Bush isn't King and the mother in Field's thread isn't Queen.
There's a lot in life that annoys and that we may disagree with. Everytime I see a Bush/Cheney 2004 bumpersticker I fight the urge to run the car off the road. But self-control and the belief in the First Amendment prevails.
"Home training. It's not just for bourgie kids. It's for all of us. Except Monique Braxton..."
ReplyDelete*Ouch* you are killing me Chris, Sean reads thisblog.
I do agree with you about the home training though. I hear the kids ont he train too, and I swear I don't even know that they are saying half the damn time.
"Lock him up for a while in the county jail. My Nigga might teach him some things."
LOL at anon.
Thanks for reading the blog jay_in_htown.
Like you I am on the fence. I just don't like law enforcement limiting speech. But then, there is such a thing as common sense and respect.
I thnk I am rightt between shazza nakim and agentx.
Damn I hete to waffle :(
Chris, I blogged about that bus diver in Washington, and I would have sent him a post card if I could. But then my feelings on tat issues was colored by my feelings about the frat boy.
So, let me see if I understand? You can call someone the "N" word, because that's your constitutional right. But if you say, MF, then you'll be arrested, because no one has a right to say "MF" in public?
ReplyDeleteI'm glad you tested our color-arousal by testing whether our reaction changed to the story when we learned the color of the arrested man's skin. I admit that my ideation, emotion and possibly behavior were changed by learning that the arrested man was white. That means that I am at least somewhat color-aroused under these circumstances.
Is there anyone here whose reaction didn't change when they saw the photo?
**And it wasn't the first time those kids heard those words, and I'm sure they've used it. And, most importantly, they will undergo no "damage" from hearing them.**
ReplyDeleteI have to disagree nelson - I don't believe the kids will undergo "damage" from hearing them but what if your kids was in 1st grade using language like this? What if you get a call from your 7 year olds teacher saying "In art class this morning, little Nelson said to another student, 'Get your hands off my motherfuckin' crayon'"? How would that make you look as a parent? What kind of reputation would the school now have of your child and what your household is like?
Nelson, how would you feel if you took your child to Disney World and this young man was cleaning up the park walking around rapping songs with profanity??? Would it make a difference then? Like Shazza said, he needs to find an appropriate place to do so. In the presence of small children is not the place to do so.
All my friends know that you cannot cuss around my child - and he's 12. Although, I AM a bit of a hypocrite b/c this morning when I went to wake him up, he had the window open and I had the heater on. I said "Close the damn window! The heat is on" I was a little angry... But, mind you, this is like the 5th time I've told him... but other than that... my household is profanity free.
I'd like to know how many of you who feel like this is no big deal and we're infringing on this mans rights have kids...
I do feel the arrest was a bit much but dude should have been sensitive to his environment.
If you cuss in front of wanna my kids....IMA say something.
ReplyDeleteIt wont be nice either...But it wont be profanity.
Ima need yall to stop cussin in front of the babies. Its tacky. And get better taste in HipHop while youre at it.
Whoops, sorry about all the bad spelling in my comments folks, this is what happens when you try to blog on the go.
ReplyDeleteI wonder if people's opinion of this incident is colored by whether they have children or not?
Just a thought.
Francis, I am starting to buy into your theory of CAS more and more :)
Field:
ReplyDeleteWe're gonna arrest people for cursing now? Wow. We must have too many jail cells and not enough warm bodies to fill 'em.
Also... have you blogged about the Henry Louis Gates special on PBS about the ancestry of a group of black celebrities? It was on last night? My wife made me turn off an excellent USA vs. Mexico football match to watch it and I wasn't disappointed. Excellent way to bring the U.S.'s jacked up history to life.
My opinion wouldn't change REGARDLESS of color. I'm in a predominately black area. I'm black. I CAN'T stand hearing folks walking down the street spewing today's rap lyrics. "Yo, bitch....suck my dick...lick my azz..." BET plays a video by an artist called Black Jesus the song is called "What that thang smell like" The lyrics are horrific. Too many of us educated negroes and liberal whites make way too many excuses for this junk. That's what these kids are rappin' these days. They're not rappin' "Humpty Dumpty sat on a wall"
ReplyDeleteYes, I needed to get that graphic because that's what I hear. It disgusts me and I find it unacceptable to say that stuff around kids. What you do inside your home is your business but once you get outside it's another story. Yes, I have a right to call the police. You're disturbing my peace!!!
hmmmnnnn...interesting...on many levels...i think being locked up is excessive...is the mother also calling the police on the homeless men on the street who walk around cursing indiscriminately, sometimes at the top of their lungs?...are you going to arrest the youth on the train using foul language or the angry businessman cursing the fall-through of a business plan?...what if they are cursing in another language?...filha da puta!!!!!!!!!...
ReplyDelete...why isn't the rapper lil boosie and his recording company held responsible for the recording and releasing of such crap?...
...i guess i need more details...but where was this dork rapper-wannabe and where were the ladies' children?...weird case indeed...although i agree there is a time and place for certain language and expression of certain views, this seems a bit outlandish...
...what's more scary is the erosion of so-called freedoms/rights...so if i am on the phone discussing the fuckery carried out by bush and friends and a republican happens to hear me and take offense, i may be liable to go to jail?...makes me wonder what the real message or point 'they' are trying to drive home, i'm sure of which fear is one...
Is there a real justification for turning bad manners into a crime?
ReplyDeleteYou may rest well assured that any law used to crack down on "drive-by cussin'" will be used to crack down on black "drive-by cussers."
Victimless crimes give police and prosecutors tremendous "discretionary" powers; and we know who will benefit from that discretion-- and who will suffer for it.
What should happen is that the boy's mouth get washed out with soap BY HIS MAMA, but it's probably way too late for that.
But jail? Might I remind you of all the semi-corrupt prosecutors (like that in Jena, Louisians) who will find a way to charge black kids and let white kids off? (and yes, I know that in this case it was a white kid who did the cussin', but every one of you knows good and damn well that given the opportunity white cops and white prosecutors will hammer black kids far out of proportion for the same thing.)
So put me down with the "no-jail" option: Lady, get a fookin' life!
Some of you just sound WAY too uptight. Is it really that serious? So he said motherfucker? Oh the horror! I don't understand why people spend their time and energy getting pissed off about words. They only have power because we give them power. Are her kids going to grow up deviants because they heard some so called bad words? I highly doubt it. Maybe I wasn't born with the gene that allows me to get offended by stupid shit but some of really y'all crack me up. Loosen up, I promise you'll love it.
ReplyDeleteI HAVE A REQUEST PLEASE - Before you post your comment, please state whether you have kids or not.
ReplyDeleteI don't walk around spouting lyrics but when my friends and I are walking down the street we curse like sailors. That's just how we talk. If someone gets offended oh well. I try to be conscious of real small children but 14?? Yeah fucking right.
ReplyDeleteI don't care what color the kid was, he shouldn't have been arrested. But he should have had his feelings hurt for saying that nonsene out loud for other people to hear. Riding public transit has become an E ticket on the profanity express. I'm not a prude but I'm just sick to death of hearing it.
ReplyDeleteAs for the t-shirt example, there's a difference between expressing an opinion and being vulgar. If the t-shirt had profanity in it, they could have been asked to leave. The mall is private property.
KIDS FREE - I dont think the man should have been arrested, but he should have stopped using that language when the authorities asked him to. Yes the older child probably hears that kind of talk all the time, but what about the 4 year old? The boy should have shut up and moved on.
ReplyDeleteWhen I saw his ethnicity, I felt conflicting emotions. At first I wanted to laugh because when I read about his crime, I thought it might have been committed by a person of color. But, after I got over my amusement, I shook my head in disgust at the low level of cross-cultural exchange we have at this time in the US.
I know that this type of music is popular with the young folks. I know you see a lot of this stuff on MTV and the other video channels, so persons of other ethnicities are becoming to like it. But dang, is that all theyre getting of Black culture? Is that the extent of their education about the Black experience? It probably is, and thats what makes it so horrible.
Sorry for the long comment.
L
I think the kid should have been cited for the continual use of the word "mf" in front of the child. If you are in public place, and are asked by someone to refrain from cursing or using offensive language, you need to stop. Your right to say whatever you want in public, ends when it becomes a threat to public safety.
ReplyDeleteYeah perhaps the use of curse words don't cause folks to get upset and want to fight, but had this man used the "n-word," "b-word" or other offensive language, all hell might have broken lose.
If he wants to curse repeatedly, he needs to do so in the privacy of his car or home. Color is not the issue in this case, its decency.
Delight on these:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/
dws/dn/latestnews/stories/
020708dnmetjena6.9a8d95b2.html
http://www.kalb.com/index.php/
news/article/jena-6-member-arrested/3290/
http://www.chron.com/disp/
story.mpl/front/5521967.html
`
~
ReplyDeleteAlso... have you blogged about the Henry Louis Gates special on PBS about the ancestry of a group of black celebrities? It was on last night? ...
joel said 9:49 AM
I caught it too, Joel.
I was surprised when the family of wrongfully executed family members;
mentioned the Jee-Na 6:
Tonight, radio personality Tom Joyner will learn the story of how two of his great uncles and three other men - all African Americans - were executed in South Carolina on the same day in 1915 for the murder of a white Civil War veteran - a murder they almost certainly did not commit.
http://www.thirteen.org/blogs/index.php?itemid=332
IMHO: No comparison.
http://www.nypost.com/seven/
02062008/tv/
whos_your_great__great_granddaddy__
338834.htm
`
Your right to say whatever you want in public, ends when it becomes a threat to public safety.
ReplyDeletePublic safety?
Public safety?
FOFLMAO! Using the word "motherfucker" is a threat to public safety?
You know, tryexcellence, back in the day, people could be fined and jailed if they frightened the horses by talking loudly.
What's next? Arresting victims of Tourette's Syndrome who can't stop cursing but need to do their grocery shopping and let a curse word slip while walking to the bus?
404Kim,
ReplyDeleteYou’ve hit on the number one reason we “protect” children from these “bad” words when you ask, “How would that make you look as a parent?”
Parents fear looking bad. They don’t want to look bad because the cultural norm says certain words shouldn’t be said because they are bad. The cultural norm also falsely ascribes children’s behavior to their parents (Parents whose children say cuss words are bad parents).
So it’s a fear based on a cultural norm and a stereotype.
Cultural norms by themselves aren’t a good reason. What if a teacher calls you and says that your 12 year old son kissed another boy? That also makes you look bad because the cultural norm is that boys shouldn’t kiss boys.
So does it being a cultural norm make it right? Is “this is just how things are” a sufficient justification. I think on close inspection, no.
If there’s an additional justification that extends beyond it being a cultural norm, please tell me.
I don’t have kids but I’ve been in several grade schools and I hear cuss/curses/swear words a lot. But guess what, we used to say the same things on my schoolyard. And it certainly shouldn’t reflect on my parents. If 99% of people do that, oh well, they are just going along with a cultural norm and haven't questioned it beyond that.
So I do not judge parents on what words their kids say. Now the question is: should I be as judgmental as the rest of society or should society be as non-judgmental as me?
And again, I will reiterate 1) that these words are “bad” because we give them that significance and 2) that all children hear or use these words, even the youngest of the young and 3) that they don’t come out lesser for it.
His race has nothing to do w/it...but I am surprised it was a white kid.
ReplyDeleteCensor yourself in public. He could have rapped the song and simply refrained for the cursing parts.
Hometraining....can we make it required???
Nelson -
ReplyDeleteYou don't have kids therefore I feel confident saying you cannot understand. You just can't
It's just like white people say there is no racism...
I had a friend who wasn't the best parent. When she talked to her children, every other word out her mouth was a curse word. She was mean, she yelled at them constantly, she was more interested in going out than spending time with them, she was always dropping them off somewhere so she wouldn't have to deal with them. She was more concerned with how she looked than how they looked. When she would take them to dinner, she'd order herself a big meal and make them share a kids me. She wasn't concerned about their behavior or their grades. Just all kinds of nonsense.
Now, if her kids are cussing at school because thats their environment, and my kid is cussing at school because he overheard some inconsiderate stranger dropping the F-bomb... someone might mistakenly compare my household and parenting to hers. When you work hard to bring your kids up properly, teach them manners, morals, stay up late with them every night to help with their homework, make sure they have a home cooked meal each night, talk to them and listen to them, give them guidance day in and day out, and do everything in your power to make sure they know they are loved - you DO NOT want to be viewed as a "bad parent" because it's HARD work being a good parent.
And if I may, I would disagree that the "cultural norm" says certain words shouldn't be said because they are bad... if anything, a responsible parent does not want their kids to follow the "cultural norm" because this culture we live in today promotes foul language, promiscuity, disrespect, ignorance, inconsideration, getting money, womanizing, and on, and on, and on.
There is a video right now on YouTube with these VERY YOUNG KIDS doing some very adult things on camera - fully clothed, but still inappropriate.
I know Field doesn't do the YouTube thing, but I'm going to post the link. I ask that you view it and let me know how you'd feel if this was your son or daughter.
http://sandrarose.com/2008/02/05/video-good-clean-wholesome-kids-at-play/
(sorry for the super long post)
Anyone remember that Chappelle's Show skit about the show Trading Spouses? The 9 year old white kid who said "I'm a gangsta, G-G-G-G-G Unit!" and then his black daddy drove him to the hood, kicked him out of the car and said "If you're so gangsta, you'll have no problems surviving. Sell some rocks, I hear that's what they do out here. G-G-G-G-Goodbye!"
ReplyDeleteWhat the F@%k ever. This is total Bulls#$t. It makes me so sick when parents try to be the moral police on other people. It's like because they had children, all of a sudden the world is supposed to cater to them. Let me be the first to say it: F#$k no!
ReplyDeleteBottom line, if you raise your children to know right from wrong, they will act accordingly. Hearing some white boy rap curse words is not going to influence your kid one way or another. Hearing it at home from momma and daddy does.
Bottom line, raise your own d@#n children and stop worrying so much about what the f#$% comes out of my mouth.
And no I was not suprised to see it was a white boy. Who in the hell else would actually BUY a Boosie cd?
@lisa:
ReplyDeleteAre her kids going to grow up deviants because they heard some so called bad words? I highly doubt it.
lisa, I can predict what this woman's kids will or will not become, but this much I'm sure of:
What we hear and what we see impacts us more than we know: if that wasn't the case, corporations wouldn't spend millions on ad campaigns to persuade us to buy their products.
And Hollywood wouldn't continue in its efforts to socialize and desensitize Americans via films that seek to foster ideologies and values that they find acceptable.
404Kim
ReplyDeleteYou're still sticking to a fear of what other people think--rather than whether the activity in question is intrinsically dangerous.
While I don't have kids, and I do not completely rule out the possibility of change, I am fairly confident that the way I raise my child will be much more open about everything, because my own observations have shown me that a properly informed child will be better adjusted in the long run.
As for the video, the very fact that you can show it to me in a meaningful discussion of children demonstrates the importance of non-censorship. How does it make me feel? Like our sexually repressed society makes sex all the more taboo and attractive. In Europe, nudity and sex is much more readily available. They also tend to be much more open about talking about sexuality. As a result, they don't have the teen pregnancy rates we have.
So is the answer controlling information, or properly informing kids? In America, we don't see the alternative, so we stick to our ways, leading to two extremes: a Christian Puritanism versus the Commercialization of taboos. This is a self perpetualizing cycle, and with every push back is an equally strong response, leading to feel like it's a never ending battle. This will continue to happen as long as we voluntarily choose to live within the flawed dichotomy.
Grown - Tell me why you "coded" the profanity in your post?
ReplyDeleteNelson - I imagine we can go back and forth about this, which is a good thing. But, you don't even have children. You may not see why that is necessary to understand my pov, but... thats because you don't have kids :-)
I think the free speech [no matter what]libertarian folks have won me over.
ReplyDeleteBut I reserve the right to change my mind after my first child.
grown, that comment was too funny:)
I don't have kids (yet), but if I do have them, I will deal with the cursing situation they way my parents did. They used it as teaching moments. They pointed out that using curse words in public is low-class behavior. They also pointed out that people who curse with every other word don't get taken seriously. Also, if you let curse words become part of your everyday language (as opposed to something that slips out in anger), it can get you in a lot of trouble.
ReplyDeleteI have a friend who curses so much in daily life, that it's affected her job. In the middle of a conversation at work one day, she let a curse word out and a supervisor heard it. It led to a suspension with no pay. I've also noticed she's been passed up on several chances for advancement, and it's probably due to her language.
You can't stop most people from acting a fool in public, but people can teach their children not to imitate fools.
I think grown should post his/her age. Anyone who has to say they are grown is probably not really.
ReplyDeleteIn any event, read grown's post and note that this is at the core of what is the matter not only with black folks but with too many folks in the US. The script goes something like:
This is America. I can say whatever I choose. What I do and say has no impact on others. And even if it does, I don't give a flying fark because this is America and I can say whatever I want to.
Of course, if YOU say something I don't like, I get to go running to the press or the internet and tell the world what a racist/bigoted/anti-semitic/sexist/intolerant/disrespectful piece of waste you are. Just like Jello, there's always room for hyprocrisy in America.
404- I coded it because clearly some people on here are sensitive about this issue. While I could give a care less about some letters put together to form a word, some people do. I was trying to be considerate. But it's shaping up to be a case of "Damned if you do and damned if you don't"...
ReplyDeleteWest Coast - For the record, I'm 25. The e-mail addy is from a long time ago...And whether you agree with it or not, freedom is the basis of America. So yes, I do feel as if I should be able to speak in whatever manner I so choose and I in turn will respect your right to do the same. In my household, cursing was not treated as a big deal. Therefore I don't see it as such. And like I said before, if PARENTS would raise their children instead of worrying about everything else under the sun, they wouldn't have to worry about such silly and mundane things as this because they would know that they raised their children to adhere to the values that they have been raised to exhibit.