Friday, March 19, 2010

When wingnuts are whining children suffer.

*
I tried to go through the day without hearing or seeing wingnuts crying about his O ness pushing Obama- care down their throats, but I couldn't. These wingnut whiners are everywhere. I guess now they are seeing how lefties felt during the run up to the frat boy's war. Billions of dollars and over 4,000 dead -brave- American soldiers later (including one who was very close to me) we can see where that got us. For some reason I am thinking that if Obama-care passes, history will be kinder to it. (Yeah, I know they had an election in Iraq recently, and the Iraqi people went out and voted. Nice. Like what were they going to do, spend the day at the beach?)

But you can't tell that to the wingnuts, they are pulling out all the stops. In fact, they did something recently that I want to blog about tonight.

Down in Ohio there is a congressman who is sitting on the fence with his vote, and the wingnuts, in what could go down as one of the most crass political acts in A-merry-can history, featured an ad. with the man's daughters. Yes, his under aged daughters.

"In southern Ohio, opponents of the bill have created a blowback effect by airing an ad targeting Rep. Steve Driehaus to stand firm as a "no" vote on the legislation. The ad prominently featured the congressman’s young daughters, in violation of the unwritten law that forbids dragging lawmakers' family members – most especially their underage children – into the fray. " [story]

Damn, even criminals have a code of honor when it comes to children. But not the wingnut, not when A-merry-ca's future is at stake.

Oh field, stop it, didn't you see where they offered an apology to the man?

Yes, I saw that. And I bet that they wish they could take the ad. back as well. I mean it's not like the damage hasn't already been done. (Just look at some of the wingnut comments under this post. )

Sadly, I am guessing that somewhere in wingnutville, they are looking for Sasha and Malia doubles.









112 comments:

M. Rigmaiden said...

People will do whatever without regards to ethics, to accomplish their goals. Expect more of the same from both sides of the political aisle.

Gregory said...

It's the seventh anniversary of the Iraq invasion, a month or so shy of the same anniversary of the "Mission Accomplished" farce on the deck of the Abraham Lincoln. Yet, Rove is on a book tour resurrecting the lies that were used to justify this action. File under the category of "You-Can't-Make-This-Shit-Up".

The howler monkeys that populate Wingnuttia are out in force, worked up over the possibility that the healthcare bill will pass. It is entertaining and depressing, in equal measure. File under the same category as above.

Anonymous said...

The attacks against Obamacare is similar in style of what the Repubs did to Hillary & Bill during the 90s...
Field Negro, did you know Hillary Clinton had to wear a bullet proof vest at a couple of Health care rallies in the 90s?...Talk of Health care has always been a dangerous conversation. The right was so obsessed in destroying Bill Clinton that they didn't care about causing harm to Hillary life. So, they are up to the same old tricks with Obama. I don't know if this time Healthcare will pass but at some point the health issues in America need addressing..

mellaneous said...

Interesting post Field. I want to piggyback on Gregory and say that I hope you can initiate a discussion on the 7th anniversary of the war in Iraq before the weekend is out or before the end of next week. Just saying..

Its a sad anniversary considering that over 4,000 US lives were lost and depending on which count you believe anywhere from 100,000 to over 500,000 Iraqi lives have been lost.

Even if Bush had not manufactured the reasons it would still not have been worth it.

One life for oil was too many!!

But there is no doubt that it benefitted some folks (Haliburton, Bechtel, Blackwater, US imperialism's interests in the region and its resources) But did it really benefit the Iraqis?

Sorry I am speaking at anti-war rally tomorrow can't get it off my mind.

mellaneous said...

Back on the subject of the post. I got this from the website of the group that made the ad

It’s time for Congress to rethink health care reform, focusing on:

•Increasing health care choices;
•Reining in health care costs, and;
•Controlling the growth of government to avoid escalating the national debt.

Which bullet point doesn't fit considering that I never hear Tea Party enthusiasts speaking out about the debt that has been incurred in order to wage war against and occupy Iraq and Afghanistan.

Anonymous said...

"But there is no doubt that it benefitted some folks (Haliburton, Bechtel, Blackwater, US imperialism's interests in the region and its resources) But did it really benefit the Iraqis?"

You forgot to mention that it benefitted the American people and their SUV's and their Caddys.

Anonymous said...

Mellaneous-"Sorry I am speaking at anti-war rally tomorrow can't get it off my mind."

Which anti-war rally is that?

Val said...

That's nothing FN, did you hear what the Rethugs did to Rep. Kathy Dahlkemper?

They are running ads accusing her of being soft cancer prevention becasue she supports Health-Care Reform. The really bad part of this is Rep. Dahlkemper lost both of her parents to, yep you guessed it, cancer. And, she lost them both within the last month.

The Rethugs have refused to pull the ads. Btw, Dahlkemper is from Pennsylvania.

Here is a link to the story and the ad:

http://thinkprogress.org/2010/03/17/afp-cancer-ad/

Anonymous said...

hmm, yep, the public will love this after is passes. Oh wait, most of the benefits don't start for years and the fees start now, nvm....

szpork

GrannyStandingforTruth said...

The Health bill is gonna pass. Only problem is that when it passes those crazy folks might go stark raving mad and really show their colors. I'd keep a close eye on them because they are some dangerous folks and some sick-minded ones at that.


Field:

Art Maggot and Frog got skills. Very talented! I love Frog's poems and the same goes for that picture Art Maggot created of that disrespectful imp on Fox We Make It Up News.

Anonymous said...

Field, should the bill not pass, will you post about it or will you go silent?

Health stocks moved big time in the market the last two days. Do you suppose some folks know something that most leftists don't know?

The way you are badgering the right, things could turn out to be quite embarrassing for you, the leftists, the Dems and zealous pro-abortionists here at FN blog. Oh wait. You progressive liberal pro-abortionist Dems have no shame so it doesn't matter... Carry on.

GrannyStandingforTruth said...

Yeah, the stock market is rigged or either the board is malfunctioning.

mellaneous said...

Ah yes shame now there is the word that I didn't think neo-cons and other minions of capitalism would even know esp,considering the definition.

A painful emotion caused by a strong sense of guilt, embarrassment, unworthiness, or disgrace

We know that the capitalists have no sense of guilt, they steal pillage, and maim and murder and blame the victim.

We know they can't be embarrassed. Their minions definitely can't be embarassed especially with the way they have misrepresented the Obama's esp Michelle with the monkey pictures. And the pictures of Obama at many of the Tea Party rallies belie any sense that these folks could be made to feel ashamed of themselves.

They can't be disgraced in fact they follow many of the more callous acts - like denying people who badly need a certain medical procedure knowing that the denial could lead to death- by explaining it away as just business.

Capitalists don't feel these emotions. And judging from Field's post neither do right wingers. BTW they said that they forgot to crop the picture of the Congressman as if they could not access a picture of him by himself.

And you really want to talk about shame. NO wonder you don't identify yourself its probably a wise thing to remain anonymous.

Trapped in SC said...

To the anonymous posters out there:

With Obama's Presidency, I feel the enduring pain of every teabagger, and believe me, I completely enjoy it.

I have a few questions though.

What do you like about the current health care setup?

Is anyone is your family sick?

Should poor people and middle class people die for lack of health care?

If you don't support "Obamacare", which plan would you support? What would your plan consist of?

Do you have a job? If you do, do you have insurance? If not, why not? Does you employer not offer it? If they offer it, is it too expensive for you too afford?

Why can't employees be in a better bargaining position in hiring negotiations?

Why do you support insurance companies? They are in it FOR THE MONEY.

Can you promise us that you won't try to get "obamacare" when you get older? When you get sick? When you need it? When your insurance company denies you because of a preexisting condi......scratch that. We know that the wingnuts who have no healthcare will be the first ones in line for a government programonly to criticize the party and the man who made it possible, hence the "git your gubment hands off my medicare" argument.
Are you against it because Tamika and Julio will be able to get the same health care as Tyler and Hayley?

I would say serious replies only, bur I know the teabaggers will have nothing but dumb shit to say.

If anyone has ever been as fucking stupid as the wingnuts and teabaggers, the government has kept it under wraps, so as not to embolden our enemies.

Folks, This health care game is poker, plain and simple. At some point in the betting, a player (Obama) is gonna call on the bluffer (republicans). And the bluffer's gonna have to show that his cards are shit, that he was lying, that he had nothing. And then the pot goes to the person who had the better hand all along. The wingnuts, the teabaggers, the anonymous posters, the phony-ass black conservatives who are BIPO's (blacks in pigmentation only) will have to show their cards soon.

And history will judge that they held the shittiest of hands.

agape2010 said...

@ FN:

Sorry...a Code of Ethics has been long gone for criminals....ever since Reaganomics ;p

The Heath Care Bill is a wrap and "they" all now it. The same process/political strategy was used to pass Clinton's budget in the first four...and it worked.

This is just another example of history repeating itself in this country to move it forward. It has been happening since the 1940's maybe?

And...

Loved the Wal Mart thing...Oh how I wish I were one of those blacks in that store whose "psychological mindset was upset...thinking that I may be in a Auschwitz-type situation and white people were outside waiting to kill me!!!!"
Good thing me and my peeps weren't there... we would have smelled a class action at the very least :)

Peace.
~agape2010~

Mack Lyons said...

Is it just me, or are the wingnuts and GOP fanboys trying to bring us back to a pre-1929 "Gilded Age"? That's the point when the only people who were raking in the big bucks were the fat cats, and they set themselves up a Plutocracy, where only they and their fellow wealthy comrades benefitted. There was no middle class. The working class ground their fingers to the bone doing factory work and the poor simply starved.

I think the plutocrats in the GOP have got the wingnuts fooled. Seems like the only thing they have to do is say "BUT THE NIGGERS WILL BENEFIT!!!" and all hell breaks loose. That's what it comes down to: a bunch of ignorant and deluded people willingly holding themselves back so Blacks will never get an opportunity to benefit. And that, my friends, is why we have trailer parks, trailer trash and the mentality that goes along with it.

And someone mentioned Artur Davis giving out his resounding NO on the health care issue. Well, it's just a case of a Black Dem ingratiating himself among a largely conservative populace by voting the same way they would vote. If he ain't careful, Ron Sparks (another Dem gov candidate) will have his ass, and rightfully so.

"Loved the Wal Mart thing...Oh how I wish I were one of those blacks in that store whose "psychological mindset was upset...thinking that I may be in a Auschwitz-type situation and white people were outside waiting to kill me!!!!"
Good thing me and my peeps weren't there... we would have smelled a class action at the very least :)"


If I ever hear anything like that at my local Wal-Mart, the first place I'd go is the sporting goods section. That's where they keep all the guns. It might be all .22 cals, but a few hunting knives and a deuce deuce suit me just fine.

agape2010 said...

@ Mack:

No you are not alone in your thinking..."they" know they are getting ready to see what the recession looks like...up close and personal :)

You reminded me of an MLK speech when he was yet again imprisoned and speaking with one of the guards who said... (para) how bad it was for poor whites and what he didn't have (yada, yada, yada) and King told him..."You need to be marching with us!"

And...

Thanks for the laugh on the image of what it looks like for all the blacks (w/o weaponry) to be running to the gun aisle at Wal Mart...I can hear us now..."I'm not leaving without a gun!" hahahahaha!!!

Peace.
~agape2010~

mellaneous said...

Mack said:

Seems like the only thing they have to do is say "BUT THE NIGGERS WILL BENEFIT!!!" and all hell breaks loose. That's what it comes down to: a bunch of ignorant and deluded people willingly holding themselves back so Blacks will never get an opportunity to benefit. And that, my friends, is why we have trailer parks, trailer trash and the mentality that goes along with it.

Hey Mack don't be so mean! But before you go to the trailer park folks I think you better check out the so-called middle class white folks in a town near you who don't live in trailers. And you should also check out the folks with the nice professional outfit complete with shirt and tie. I think they are leading this charge.

Case in point did you check out what columnist David Brooks of the NYTimes wrote on today. Check out the link he gets some of his ideas from some of the same places as UCF only he doesn't express them as muddled or incoherent as the self appointed conservator does. (lol)

This is the Brooks link for anyone interested in how the neo conservatives are reframing the problems of capitalism. Must read for folks who want to be in the know.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/19/opinion/19brooks.html?src=me&ref=homepage

agape2010 said...

@ Trapped in Sc:

"Are you against it because Tamika and Julio will be able to get
the same health care as Tyler and Hayley?"


oops...there it is :)

Peace.
~agape2010~

mellaneous said...

Trapped in S.C and Agape-
ditto on the Tamika and Julio line I am going to use it at some point if you don't mind Trapped. I'll give you credit.

agape2010 said...

@ FN:

If you think your boy at Detroit Public Schools Superintendent is bad...here's a reminder of the worst kind:

"So I analyzed that and decided I didn't want to be the president during a depression greater than the Great Depression, or the beginning of a depression greater than the Great Depression." --George W. Bush, Washington D.C., Dec. 18, 2008

"People say, well, do you ever hear any other voices other than, like, a few people? Of course I do." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Dec. 18, 2008

And to think we decided to get an education and a real job :-p

Peace.
~agape2010~

Anonymous said...

Granny--"The Health bill is gonna pass. Only problem is that when it passes those crazy folks might go stark raving mad and really show their colors. I'd keep a close eye on them because they are some dangerous folks and some sick-minded ones at that."

I agree. IF the bill passes, there probably will be an anti-Obama healthcare backlash, which will make those gun totin teabaggers look like very nice people.

However, I am not sure the bill will pass. I think the GOP, along with some Democratics will stop it.

I don't think the Dems have the votes they think they have to pass the bill.

mellaneous said...

Field forgive me for hi-jacking a bit but we are talking about the behavior of neo-cons right? And an anon came on and started talking about how folks should have shame.And I know I keep talking about this David Brooks commentary entitled "The Broken Society" but..

-I had to talk about it because of the hidden codes in it. I think you,Jody, AB and Trapped especially would get a kick out of it. And my socialist friends will really get a scream.

Check this neo-con dissembler out:

"First, there was a revolution from the left: a cultural revolution that displaced traditional manners and mores; a legal revolution that emphasized individual rights instead of responsibilities; a welfare revolution in which social workers displaced mutual aid societies and self-organized associations."

Of course there was no revolution there was social change and upheavel but no revolution.

-check out what he means by cultural revolution and the displacing of traditional values is that women were let out of the kitchen and were afforded rights in society and the workplace. Doggone it we have to treat dem gals like human beings. It's also a slam at gay rights.

-the legal revolution he refers to is the civil rights movement and he is complaining that,'niggers got their rights and didn;t know their place anymore.

- his complaint about the welfare revolution is that dagonit the government which has been responsible for helping the wealthy and big business now has to help its citizens who they were supposed to be helping in the first place. What he is saying is dag the niggers and them po crackers get to have welfare now we just can't let them starve.

Of course that crap about mutual aid societies is just that, they couldn't mend the hole in the safety net that capitalist enterprise ultimately makes.

Anonymous said...

Mellaneous-"Sorry I am speaking at anti-war rally tomorrow can't get it off my mind."

Really? I would like to hear you speak because I love a good talk at anti-war rally. BTW, if you scroll up you will find that another anon asked you "which anti-war rally" you would be speaking at.

I would like to know also.

mellaneous said...

Okay I'll bite I just thought it was an anon that is always throwing rocks my way. But I will be in Mpls near the University of Minnesota campus.

Anonymous said...

"I agree. IF the bill passes, there probably will be an anti-Obama healthcare backlash, which will make those gun totin teabaggers look like very nice people.
I don't think the Dems have the votes they think they have to pass the bill."-1:08 AM

Sounds "MORE" like your hoping the bill fails.

Anonymous said...

Mellaneous-"Sorry I am speaking at anti-war rally tomorrow can't get it off my mind."

We all know why you ignored the question because it was a lie. You are so FOS, and it is clear that you are a miserable person.

You "shame" your own profession of ministry. No sincere genuine minister would say the things you do, except your Christian brother Pat Robertson. You are a disgrace.

Now go on your knees and pray for forgiveness.

Anonymous said...

"Sounds "MORE" like your hoping the bill fails."

Absolutely not. I hope it passes but it doesn't look to me as thought they have the votes.

mellaneous said...

Field I'll stop by Brooks and this guy he is quoting out of the UK Phillip Bond are amusing the hell out of me with their crap.

check these out and I will let it go:

"The effort to liberate individuals from repressive social constraints didn’t produce a flowering of freedom; it weakened families, increased out-of-wedlock births and turned neighbors into strangers."

Huh the push for civil and human rights caused more out of wed-lock births? When folks had more rights on the job and were elgible for jobs they had been previously locked out of the family unit actually strengthened they could move to better place, afford a car, actually take a vacation etc.

Is he suggesting that the civil rights and human rights struggle for equality was bad because some folks got pissed that 'niggers and gals and gays got rights.'

- the guy Blond actually used the term "remoralize the market"

- I wonder now just how is it possible to remoralize the market that has never been moral in the first place. Thats a contradiction you can't re do something that hasn't been done in the first place.

-Imagine that moral capitalism.
Lawd have mercy!

-And here is the coup de grace!
Brooks writes that:

“The project of radical transformative conservatism is nothing less than the restoration and creation of human association, and the elevation of society and the people who form it to their proper central and sovereign station.”

Yeah right just don't ever need any help.

mellaneous said...

Anon said:

"You "shame" your own profession of ministry. No sincere genuine minister would say the things you do,"

I get the since that you wouldn't know a sincere minister of the gospel if they stepped on your foot.

And I should have known to ignore your question I don't understand why you claim to be a Christian and do and say the things you do.

I have no reason to lie. You should come tomorrow I will be talking about your beloved US imperialism and the evil that it perpetuates through using our children to kill other folks children for oil and profit.

And its too bad more preachers don't preach about the things I do.

You do realize that your throwing rocks at me says more about you than me. I don't think anybody in their right mind would suggest that Jesus would not be supportive of the poor and the down and out. And I follow the teachings of Jesus, which is why you come on her and try to chastise me.

It won't work I'm not going away and you're only making yourself look bad.

Anonymous said...

Dude, it is like watching a 4 year yelling and screaming and wanting what it wants.....at all cost.

The American political system is one of the most idiotic things this world has ever seen and getting worse. If the Rethugs ever get power back the lying, cheating and stealing they were doing in broad daylight under Bush will triple-fold.

The Gop has NO MORALS, they want to win and protect the monied interests at all costs and the sooner the fools on the bottom of the totem pole ever learn after 30 years of Reagan/Bush will be a day we can all feel better.....but not now with Obama in the WH.....it is driving them nuts!!!!

Mack Lyons said...

"Is he suggesting that the civil rights and human rights struggle for equality was bad because some folks got pissed that 'niggers and gals and gays got rights."

Yep. That's basically what it all boils down to. No one wants to admit it, but it is what it is.

These same people are the ones admiring their wealthy "betters" from afar....and then they go back to toiling away in the fields and factories, struggling for the few crumbs their betters see fit to throw on the ground for them.

Makes me think that some people are just better suited to be "subjects" under some plutocratic oligarchy than actually be "citizens" of a free nation. Their mindsets simply can't cope with any notion of equality.

Anonymous said...

TSC, "I have a few questions though.

What do you like about the current health care setup?"

Ans. It provides healthcare to "most" Americans, esp those without healthcare.

TSC "Is anyone is your family sick?"

Ans. NO.

TSC "Should poor people and middle class people die for lack of health care?"

Ans. Of course NOT. No human beings should lose their lives due to lack of health care.

TSC "If you don't support "Obamacare", which plan would you support? What would your plan consist of?

Ans. N/A

TSC "Do you have a job? If you do, do you have insurance? If not, why not? Does you employer not offer it? If they offer it, is it too expensive for you too afford?"

Ans. Yes, I have a job. Yes, I have insurance. No, my company's group health insurance is not expensive.

TSC "Why can't employees be in a better bargaining position in hiring negotiations?" Ans. I have no idea. I negotiated my salary before I started work. I think quite a few people do, based on their skills and the corporations needs. However, if it's a blue collar job it might be due to a weak union or no union at all.

TSC "Why do you support insurance companies? They are in it FOR THE MONEY."

Ans. I don't support insurance companies and of course, all businesses exist to make money. It's the American capitalistic way.

I hope my answers helped you.

mellaneous said...

Mack thanks I was wondering if I was missing his point. I didn't think I was.

I feel what you said below. But I think folks are either afraid or on some level to take their plight into their own hands and make the changes that are needed.

Makes me think that some people are just better suited to be "subjects" under some plutocratic oligarchy than actually be "citizens" of a free nation. Their mindsets simply can't cope with any notion of equality.

Gregory said...

I think the 'baggers are going to be in for a surprise when the HCR bill passes through Congress. The uprising they expect will fail to materialize. Simple as that, the outrage that they have been trying to manufacture will be stillborn.

Just an opinion, mind you, as I am sure the regular commenters who typically post later in the threads will be anxious to quote and bebunk in mixed CASE.

Anonymous said...

Mellaneous "And I should have known to ignore your question I don't understand why you claim to be a Christian and do and say the things you do.

I have no reason to lie. You should come tomorrow I will be talking about your beloved US imperialism and the evil that it perpetuates through using our children to kill other folks children for oil and profit."

I appreciate your reply. However, you remind me of Jane Fonda who went to Hanoi during the Vietnam War to chum up with the North Vietnamese and denounce our country's imperialism but she still has yet to fight for her fellow Americans in the poorer community.

Why aren't you helping to raise up our people in the hood instead of trying to go 'national' and/or 'global'- which won't save one life or make one iota bit of difference to our black children who are suffering and dying in the streets?

Rev Mellaneous, have you ever been wrong in your life, and found that you were on the wrong path? No one elected you to go about speaking at war rallys. God elected you to speak about Christ, the Spirit, and the Good Book. It sounds like you enjoy and prefer being a politician instead of a preacher.

So WHY are you a minister? Why not just be a politician which you seem to love more than God? You know, few Americans ever hear much about Christ but they sure hear that same old tune about American imperialism all the time.

Btw, the US doesn't own a thing in Iraq so your assumption that we are there for oil and profit 'might' be wrong. How about preaching at rallys about the American people's addictions to oil, SUV'S-big cars, and the overt excessives of living?

Mell, there will always be wars. The war problem doesn't lie with oil, diamonds, ravaging the land, the climate and profits, the problem lies "within us". It is a spiritual malady of the human heart. You being a minister ought to know that...

Instead, you are running around and blending in like some Jane Fonda where no one can tell you from anybody else, simply because you sound like everybody else who has no contact with God.

Constructive Feedback said...

Filled Negro:

It appears that if anyone SHOULD be disturbed about where they stand at present it should be the PROGRESSIVE-FUNDAMENTALIST.

Let me describe to you a blog post and accompanying image that I am preparing.

Years ago as the Progressive movement was initiated this IN-ORGANIC, Grievance based movement focused upon LOCAL government and corporate forces that stood against them. They demanded that the forces CHANGE their ways so that relief could come.

AFTER THEY WON THE LOCAL SEATS OF POWER with Progressives in place.....their GRIEVANCES remained. As a result they went to the STATE LEVEL. They demanded relief from these seats of government power and the corporations within the state.

After they won various STATE powers and formed an identifiable REGIONAL power block (now known as the "Rust Belt") they now had control over the politics, economy, academics and social policies in these areas.

Despite this POWER - they STILL WERE AGGRIEVED.

After doing another inventory they sought to GO NATIONAL, raiding control over the entire federal government. They hoped that by having a VERTICAL MACHINE OF POWER in place where the progressive policies where tied together at the 3 tiers of government (really 4th - the household) they figured that by DESTROYING and REDEVELOPING the social contract that they would one day find peace.

Few of them (you all) are willing to allow for the notion "PAST IS PROLOGUE" to make note that in your IN-ORGANIC ideology - you are now standing on the WEST COAST, just as the "American Settlers" did and thus you are no longer able to EXPAND AWAY FROM your problems. You will now have to return back to the turf that you have trampled all of the vegetation upon and PRODUCE GROWTH.

Unfortunately while you look at WAR COSTS of the Military Industrial Complex the truth is that the most expansive DEBT GROWTH is among the key programs that YOU hold up as your CROWNING ACHIEVEMENTS:

* Social Security
* Medicare
* Medicaid

In your HATRED (which you hide as Social Justice) you will merely STRIKE OUT against those who attempt to hide their wallets from you in a defense against your confiscatory nature. You will one day see that you cannot CONFISCATE your way into prosperity.

That only ORGANIC GROWTH will sustain you.

Upon this realization the SCHOOLS and the CULTURAL ENFORCEMENTS that you now have control over need to be shifted from "portraits upon the wall" showing your GREATNESS over to KEY RESOURCES THROUGH WHICH YOU MANAGE TOWARD YOUR DESIRED OUTCOMES.

I think personally that many of you all are too IDEOLOGICALLY BIGOTED to ever develop a truly ORGANIC SET OF PRODUCTIONS. Your power comes from DELIVERY SOUP one ladle at a time to the "Least of These" instead of changing them into the "UN-LEAST OF THESE".

Once you cut the throats of all Republicans - you will have to make a NEW SET OF "Republicans" to maintain your IN-organic drive.

mellaneous said...

Anon said:

"The war problem doesn't lie with oil, diamonds, ravaging the land, the climate and profits, the problem lies "within us". It is a spiritual malady of the human heart. You being a minister ought to know that... "

-Actually I do and on this point we agree. But I also believe that systems that encourage greed and avarice from which flow even murder for the attainment of wealth power and riches are also part of the problem.

-These systems actually encourage folks to do wrong but hide their true intentions and true function behind, sayings such as well that's the cost of doing business, or its not personal its just business.

-I disagree with you about whether I distinguish myself with my positions.

-Many people who are otherwise turned off by religion, have related to me that they find it refreshing that a person who claims to represent God is actually opposed to the killing of God's people for material resources and power, when so many others of God's people are silent and some even cheerlead this behaviour.

-And I definitely don't sound like everyone else who doesn't claim to know God. Let's face it the vast majority are okay with the evils of capitalism, as you pointed out as long they can drive their SUV's and live lavish lifestyles they could care less about the rest of the world.

-They especially are quiet about issues like hunger, poverty, homelessness, unequal education, labor rights, discrimination and unjust wars. Concern for these issues I think is consistent with the compassion of God and Jesus when he was on earth.

-I think this makes me quite different from "everybody else who has no contact with God."

NSangoma said...

~
Girlfriend, says that she would do it again; unfortunately she is not talking about fornicating:

HONG KONG -- Former U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said Friday she would "many times over liberate" Iraq again, ...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/03/19/AR2010031900914.html

4400 US dead
= POWER(10,12) US dollars
again, and again, and ...

Fresh from a two-day weekend visit to Iraq, the Bush administration's top health-care official defended the $950 million that will be spent to help Iraq establish universal health care.

Congressional Democrats have criticized the administration for helping Iraq to establish universal health care without doing the same for U.S. citizens.

Health and Human Services Secretary Tommy Thompson said yesterday there are major differences between the two countries that defy simple comparisons.

"Even if you don't have health insurance," said Thompson, who toured medical facilities in the Iraqi cities of Baghdad and Tikrit on Saturday and Sunday, "you are still taken care of in America. That certainly could be defined as universal coverage. Every American's health care is far superior to what the health care is in Iraq."

Universal coverage as in... the emergency room, Tommy? Oohh, I need some Tylenol. I wonder if it's covered by COBRA. It should be for $20,000 a year.

http://www.thepoliticalcarnival.net/2009/10/tommy-thompson-2004-universal-care-is.html

A billion here and a billion there, and soon you are talking about real money.
`

field negro said...

Go get em at that rally mellaneous. I see that after you answered the wingnut didn't respond. Typical.

BTW, don't ever worry about jacking a thread on this site. Every thread is an open thread.

"'TSC "Is anyone is your family sick?"'

Ans. NO."'

We might as well stop right there.

"You "shame" your own profession of ministry. No sincere genuine minister would say the things you do,"


If that's the case maybe it's the minister profession that has a problem.

LOL@ agape @ 1:06 am. I forgot about that guy.

"Field, should the bill not pass, will you post about it or will you go silent?"

Post about it. Why wouldn't I? No one is saying it's a done deal. Relax. I know you are fasting and praying this weekend so I am going to leave you alone.

[un]constructive one, may I ask you a question that I have been meaning to for awhile:?

WTF is "ORGANIC GROWTH"? And how exactly can us po black folks achieve it? Does it have anything to growing foods in our back yards? I am serious. I am not as smart as you political scholars, so you have to help me out with this one. Thanks!

field negro said...

Yes Granny, those boyz have some skills don't they.

As for Wal-Mart.....I think that's a post for another day. Hell there is a book in there somewhere. And yes, some of those people are considering a lawsuit.
Waiting for more facts to come out.

NSangoma said...

~
Yeah but will the Chin do the fighting and the dieing/dying?

... The recession also precipitated a milestone for Saudi Arabia and the global energy market. While China's successful economic policies paved the way for a quick rebound there, the recession caused a deeper slowdown in the United States, slashing oil consumption by 10 percent from its 2005-7 peak. As a result, Saudi Arabia exported more oil to China than to the United States last year.
While exports to the United States might rebound this year, in the long run the decline in American demand and the growing importance of China represent a fundamental shift in the geopolitics of oil.
...
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/20/business/energy-environment/20saudi.html
`

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]Its a sad anniversary considering that over 4,000 US lives were lost and depending on which count you believe anywhere from 100,000 to over 500,000 Iraqi lives have been lost.

Even if Bush had not manufactured the reasons it would still not have been worth it.

One life for oil was too many!!
[/quote]

Mellaneous:

As I read through your posts I was going to post the words "My contempt for you grows after each post".

THIS IS INACCURATE. It is actually my EMPATHY for your condition grows.

Mellaneous it is more accurate to say: "With each post YOU SHOW YOURSELF to be a Contemptible Fellow"

I will now turn this from a "personal attack" upon you into a PROVABLE POINT.

1) You say that NO LIFE IS WORTH OIL. This and other words above is said from the vantage point of a PERSON WHO'S LIFE AND STANDARD OF LIVING is ABSTRACTED from the question of HIS WORDS. Mellaneous you could have said "I have stopped drinking petroleum because it gives me an upset stomach". These words, true or not, would be as IRRELEVANT as your MERE words above.

EVEN IF THE LAST 20 BARRELS OF OIL that have been consumed to SUSTAIN YOUR LIFESTYLE where taken by SHOOTING AN IRAQI DIRECTLY IN THE HEAD........you remain affixed on your FAKE MORAL HIGH GROUND.

I thought that the land in Gaza was "holy land" with contention. NO.
The MORAL HIGH GROUND upon which Mellaneous and others stand upon where the mysticism that exists between their THOUGHTS and their ACTUAL LIVES are kept magically and permanetnly divided with the waters of the Red Sea are the lands that are more noteworthy.

2) Notice that Mellaneous talks about 4,000+ Dead American soliders. He then talks about 100K to 500K Iraqi lives.

Just as I believe that Mell believes that the LEAST OF THESE BLACKS AND POOR in America are INFERIOR - this same viel of inferiority is extended to the Iraqi people. Let me explain.

You see - Mellanous, a most contemptible fellow is not going to true up what WE ALL SEE IN IRAQ with his MORAL HIGH GROUND. Through each STREET BOMBING where Muslim makes uninitiated terrorist attacks against another Muslim - most certainly this death does not EQUAL the death of a bullet from a superior American M-16 shot through the head of an IRAQI.

If the pattern is maintain with his domestic talking points we will hear Mellenous say two points:

* The INVASION by the Americans TRIGGERED the Iraqis to start killing themselves. (akin to saying that THEY RESPECTED HUMAN LIFE and then the USA, in showing no respect for it - triggered all of this)

* Or Saddam Hussein, though oppressive - KEPT THE LID ON THIS VIOLENCE. When BUSH pulled the cork out of the bottle HE triggered this carnage.

I wonder if our friend Mellenous would EVER say "The US Prison system as it locks up Americans who have a profile of STREET VIOLENCE, though oppressive and unjust - ultimately serves a particular purpose of maintaining peace on our streets?

Constructive Feedback said...

MELLAENOUS WILL NEVER, NEVER, NEVER say this.
This would force him, a revered elder akin to "Yoda", to come down off of his sacred mountain and render a judgment that goes against his JUSTICE DISPENSATION.

Now that I think about it Melleneous is not a "contemptible fellow". He was sent to us by GOD. His job is to remind us sinners and blood thirsty capitalists of the great damage that our insatible apetite and greed have on others.

I just wonder why there are so few "Mellaneouses" among the POOR who are OUTSIDE OF THE BELLY OF THE BEAST. They have no OIL that was stolen to power the cars that they don't have. They don't have chemicals to poison the ground water table as they seek to keep the bugs from eating their crops. In fact they have no crops for Global Warming has burned them all up.

Thank you God for sending us Mellaneous.

Now please send him among the "salt of the Earth" that exist OUTSIDE of the belly to comfort these dispirited souls.

His work is done among us fattened calves.

field negro said...

CF, you didn't answer my question.

Val, thanks for that story from here in Pistolvania. Yes, I am aware of it. There is no limit to what the wingnut will do. They think it's a just cause. "By Any Means Necessary" I guess.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]WTF is "ORGANIC GROWTH"? And how exactly can us po black folks achieve it? Does it have anything to growing foods in our back yards? I am serious. I am not as smart as you political scholars, so you have to help me out with this one. Thanks![/quote]

My BFF Filled Negro:

I keep making too many assumptions about you and others. I should have known that in your mass gatherings of confiscators certain terms are not dare mentioned. It would be sacrilege.

A SCENARIO to describe ORGANIC GROWTH and DEVELOPMENT would be far more appropriate.

Filled Negro - More than 50 years ago the Least Of These people in West Philly were not happy with their condition in life. The community had "reverse gentrified" and they were issolated. Schools that were short of their expectations. Limited employment opportunity among some of them. (The men in particular). Police commanded by Frank Rizzo who beat a brother and then asked them to show ID, later fining him for putting teeth marks in their night stick. Hell Filled Negro - the police didn't even have the decency to pull the teeth out of the wood and hand them BACK to the brother that was beaten down.


ORGANIC DEVELOPMENT would have been the mandated TWIN BROTHER of the "POLITICAL ACTIVISM" and PROTESTS that transpired in response to those issues I listed above.

The strategy that was taken can be summed up under the statement "Once WE GET IN POWER.....THINGS WILL CHANGE. We will have people who care about our community and our interests". You see, Filled Negro the NON-ORGANIC strategy focused upon putting "favorable backsides" into the seats of power, figuring that everything would take care of itself.

Here is what I don't understand Filled Negro. Leftist film maker Reginald Hudland can go on with your buddy Roland Martin and say what I SAY: "Black folks have been fighting for so long that the skills on how to GOVERN once we got into place were never developed". Yet reaction to his words are very different.

You see in his view the people who now hold power but don't know how to manage should be afforded "on the job training". If it takes them 50 years. So be it. For ME: I WANT THEM OUT for their type of incompetence is deadly to our people.

Their message is foul because they don't see the PEOPLE AS A FORCE who's "BACKS" will bring forth our desired goals - UPON BEING ORDERED BY THIS MANAGEMENT that I speak of. (Thus ORGANIC DEVELOPMENT).

Instead, Filled Negro - they, like you have a 'SERVICE MODEL' in mind. Their brand of goverment SERVICES THE PEOPLE.

If there is a NEED - take it to LEGISLATION.

If you slip up and then have control over the local LEGISLATURE, you STILL PASS LEGISLATION but there is NO MONEY TO PAY FOR IT - you remain undetered.

You see Filled Negro - those practicing ORGANIC DEVELOPMENT will see that for them to achieve their LOCAL STANDARD OF LIVING GOALS they will need to turn to the HUMAN RESOURCES who most want to live at this level and get them to ORDER THEMSELVES into agents of PRODUCTIVITY.

Unfortunately we have individuals who are from the church of "Social Justice" that Glen Beck talked about. I am not sure if they all used the same Web Master or not though. In their case they see this living standard as a SOCIETAL RIGHT FOR ALL. Thus they will look to get SERVICED UP TO THIS STANDARD.

Constructive Feedback said...

So get this Filled Negro: No matter how much a person TRIES to drill down to a lower standard of living per HIS OWN REPETTIVE DIGGING ACTIONS.....the lords of "social justice" will rescue him from HIMSELF. (Think of a serial suicide patient). Their LOVE FOR THIS PERSON exceeds the person's own love for himself. Besides it was SOCIETY that made him this way and THEY ARE GOING TO PAY for making him suicidal.

After decades and decades of this perverte strategy, Filled Negro the SERVICED never develop ORGANIC SKILLS by which they can look into their community and:

* Provide medical services since they...
* Have quality schools that are providing physicians who.....
* Are generating MONEY per the value that they are creating which can.....
* Be put into a BANK and be invested back into the community.

Filled Negro - who needs Maxine Water's stink'in "Community Reinvestment Act' when you have an ORGANIC DEVELOPMENT CULTURE?

Come to think about it I need to ask that Chinese restaurant owner or the Indian dry cleaning guy that I used yesterday if they got their businesses started via the law called 'community reinvestment act'?

Frank Drackman said...

Hey Seriously, y'all N-Words, take it from a real Doct, I mean Pro-Vider...
When Y'all finally get your free health insurance, do yourselves a favor and go to an N-Word Doct, I mean Pro-Vider.
Cause no-one else likes you, I mean, we have to see you if you show up, but thats why we make you wait longer, and give you placebos(Tuskeegee, anyone?), I mean why else do you think your Life Expectancy is 20 years less than even the HAITIANS!!!!!
Cause they mostly rely on alternative therapies, and when they DO go to the doctor they're polite, shower, and pay cash...Give me a Jean-Luque over a Kamanisha any day of the weak...
Seriously, if you want real medicine instead of moldy old aspirins in a shiny brand name bottle, find one of the umm I don't know, I think there's 2 or 3 N-Word Docs in Atlanta that take Medicare...
I mean, even the Surgeon General sees about 1 patient/year, and she's one of Y'all...
So take 2 Aspirin and don't call me in the morning,



Frank

Curt said...

"Billions of dollars and over 4,000 dead -brave- American soldiers later (including one who was very close to me) we can see where that got us."
Field, you're not the only one by far, but I can't understand why we count our own dead in the Iraq war and not innocent Iraqis who'd still be alive if it weren't for our frat boy's delusions. I really believe no man [or woman] is an island and Iraqis who didn't choose Saddam didn't choose to die while their country was being "liberated" either. So we have to count their lives too, and while we don't know the exact count I understand they're in the hundreds of thousands.

MeandMyMicroscope said...

While I'm in favor of health care reform, I'm NOT in favor of this bill. The following groups of people are entitled to free health care IMHO:

1) Children and college students up to age 25.
2) The unemployed
3) Poor/middle class elderly ONLY.

Smokers should NOT get free healthcare, and people who are overweight without a medical cause, shouldn't get free healthcare either.

I also think insurance companies should be not for profit, and that if you want free health care for everyone, expand the program federal employees get. Of course, all of that is moot without tort reform.

Anonymous said...

Why aren't you helping to raise up our people in the hood instead of trying to go 'national' and/or 'global'- which won't save one life or make one iota bit of difference to our black children who are suffering and dying in the streets?

STOP RIGHT THERE. OUR PEOPLE IN THE HOOD??? I AM ONE OF UPTOWN'S FOLLOWERS, THOSE ARE YOUR PEOPLE, NOT MINE. WE HAVE COLLEGE PRESIDENTS NOW YOU KNOW. REMOVE THE YOKE!!!!

Val said...

@MeandMyMicroscope


"Smokers should NOT get free healthcare, and people who are overweight without a medical cause, shouldn't get free healthcare either."

Aren't those people already getting free health-care? When they go to the emergency room and then can't pay who pays for it?

So at least with health-care reform they pay part of the cost, either through taxes or by paying for subsidized insurance.

Also if anyone who lives an unhealthy lifestyle could be denied then almost no one would qualify.

What about people who ride motorcycles? Or people that drink? Or people that eat too much salt?

If everyone is allowed to participate then it's cheaper for everyone.

Don't you agree?

Farman said...

"People will do whatever without regards to ethics, to accomplish their goals. Expect more of the same from both sides of the political aisle."

I think you're trying to be too fair. We see it on one side of the aisle in much larger numbers. In fact, rarely do we see it on the other side of the aisle, if ever.

MeandMyMicroscope said...

Val said...
Aren't those people already getting free health-care? When they go to the emergency room and then can't pay who pays for it?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

No actually they aren't, taxpayers are footing the bill!! And many hospitals are/have closed down due to having so many non-paying patients.

Allow me to address this first. A BIG part of why some people are poor is because they made dumb decisions in their lives and continue to make dumb decisions. Case in point, I have a cousin a high school drop out, that had 3 babies before she turned 19, ALL out of wedlock, and all from different men. Now's she's pregnant with her 4th!! Beyond maternal care, why in the hell should she be entitled to free health care, in addition to the free housing and food she already gets? Yet she manages to keep her kids in Ralph Lauren for kids???

Until folks start DYING/SUFFERING in great numbers because of their dumb decisions, things aren't going to change. Maybe people would think twice about eating a lot of salt if they thought there was no medical safety net to catch them. Maybe people wouldn't have 15 kids if they thought they might have to actually take care of them without gov't medical and other assistance. And maybe a motorcycle rider would remember to use her lid if she thought she would get stuck with the medical bills!

I for one, don't think it's fair that people who take care of themselves should pay the same insurance rates as for example, that women who's trying to gain 1000 lbs. And why should I have to pay taxes on sodas when I don't overindulge in them?

If the gov't wants to sponsor something for free, they should start with college educations!!!!

Val said...

@MeandMyMicroscope

Yes, some people are always going to be irresponsible. But we can mitigate the financial cost of their irresponsibility by lowering health-care costs.

Although the current HC Bill is not perfect it begins to lower costs to the taxpayer. Hopefully as time goes on the Bill will be refined. Maybe we will even get a non-profit public insurance company.

In the mean time it's better to have everyone insured.

ArtMaggot Hysteria said...

Is anyone watching the "We Count" discussion on UStream today?

MeandMyMicroscope said...

Val said...
@MeandMyMicroscope

Yes, some people are always going to be irresponsible. But we can mitigate the financial cost of their irresponsibility by lowering health-care costs.

Although the current HC Bill is not perfect it begins to lower costs to the taxpayer. Hopefully as time goes on the Bill will be refined. Maybe we will even get a non-profit public insurance company.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

And why should careless people have their medical costs mitigated at all? Wanna ride a bike without a lid and can't afford the medical expenses related to 3 weeks in the neurological ICU? Then perhaps if the family had to sit by and watch the lidless one suffer at home wihthout ANY medical intervention, would make the bike rider think twice about riding without a lid.

Sounds cold that's true, but being "nicey nicey" in public service announcements about the dangers of not wearing helmets isn't working worth a damn!

field negro said...

So CF, what you are saying, in a nutshell, is that people in these communities need to learn to develop certain skills to sustain themsevles. Is that correct?

And the way to do it is not with the political system in place now being run by the leftist black quasi Socialist. Is that correct?

I am trying to learn. Help me out.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]But we can mitigate the financial cost of their irresponsibility by lowering health-care costs. [/quote]

Val:

Are you comfortable with this logic?

I realize that Angela Davis is a lefty but I doubt that even she would see it this way.

Here is what political economists have said:

You TAX the behavior you seek to suppress.

You SUBSIDIZE the behavior that you seek to PROMOTE.

Your words above is a molestation of what we know as civilized humans.

The truth is that when a group of perverted "social justice" people gather together and engineer a strategy in which REGARDLESS OF HOW MANY TIMES A PERSON SEEKS TO LIVE BELOW A CERTAIN STANDARD - they are present to RESCUE HIM from HIMSELF - you can be sure Val that all sorts of "force disruptions" will take place among human-kind.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]people in these communities need to learn to develop certain skills to sustain themsevles. Is that correct?

And the way to do it is not with the political system in place now being run by the leftist black quasi Socialist. Is that correct?
[/quote]

A few points Filled Negro:

1) It is not necessarily "the people". Instead it is the MESSAGING held by the PEOPLE and their ESTABLISHMENT LEADERSHIP that is foul.

2) When you take away a people's DIGNITY then what you have is the situation that we see presently. When these people buy into their notion that the fact that their father inseminated them in the qualifying land THUS they have the expectation to be SERVICED up to the level of the standard of living that they desire BUT their PRODUCTIVE ACTIONS don't support.......Filled Negro - what we have is a situation of a people (regardless of their color) deciding to call themselves "Toby" because refusing to do so is a harder row to hoe.

3) The Black community is NOT run by BLACK LEFTISTS. We only need to do a "follow the money" trail to see that these Negroes are merely fronts for Snarling Fox White liberals.

That plain white bus that I saw in the year 2000 election at an urban mall, Filled Negro, was paid for by billionaire leftist George Soros instead of a Black organization seeking to "Get The Black Vote Out........so that it can vote for the Democrats".

You see Filled Negro - without DIGNITY one will begin to believe that being SERVICED is equalent to leveraging the power that you have amassed to turn out better outcomes - REGARDLESS of your ability to tax the WHITE FOLKS who's major contribution to you is that they MOVED AWAY and allowed you to appoint your own leadership team that you felt represented your interests yet making you wait so long to enumerate them.

Anonymous said...

VAl said:

"Although the current HC Bill is not perfect it begins to lower costs to the taxpayer."

I don't think you ahve been paying attention. This bil will cost the taxpayers trillions, and that's just at the present level of provsions. As Obama has said, this is just the start.

field negro said...

"You see Filled Negro - without DIGNITY one will begin to believe that being SERVICED is equalent to leveraging the power that you have amassed to turn out better outcomes - REGARDLESS of your ability to tax the WHITE FOLKS who's major contribution to you is that they MOVED AWAY ..."

So will the republicans give us this "dignity" you seek? Because someone has to be in control. Right?

Or are you saying that we should forget about the political institutions in place?

Ms. Ann G. Myma said...

#37?



The World Health Organization's ranking
of the world's health systems.





1 France
2 Italy
3 San Marino
4 Andorra
5 Malta
6 Singapore
7 Spain
8 Oman
9 Austria
10 Japan
11 Norway
12 Portugal
13 Monaco
14 Greece
15 Iceland
16 Luxembourg
17 Netherlands
18 United Kingdom
19 Ireland
20 Switzerland
21 Belgium
22 Colombia
23 Sweden
24 Cyprus
25 Germany
26 Saudi Arabia
27 United Arab Emirates
28 Israel
29 Morocco
30 Canada
31 Finland
32 Australia
33 Chile
34 Denmark
35 Dominica
36 Costa Rica
37 United States of America
38 Slovenia
39 Cuba
40 Brunei
41 New Zealand
42 Bahrain
43 Croatia
44 Qatar
45 Kuwait
46 Barbados
47 Thailand
48 Czech Republic
49 Malaysia
50 Poland

con't

http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html

Gregory said...

OK, Field, maybe you can sort this out. Is the problem STREET PIRATES or WHITEY? Did CF's talking points shift during my absence?

maria said...

I don't think you ahve been paying attention. This bil will cost the taxpayers trillions, and that's just at the present level of provsions. As Obama has said, this is just the start.

YOU have not been paying attention. read the latest CBO numbers, then slink back to your cave and brew a pot.

Trapped in SC said...

Constructive Wingnut is not a wingnut, he's fascist-lite.

The only ways that his fanciful theories abut black achievement, or his declaration of it's lack thereof, can work is in a world where all of the criminals, all of the welfare recipients, all of murderers, all of the murdered, all of the immoral, all of the incapable, all of the lazy, all of the troublesome, and all of the burdensome are eliminated, neutralized, or reeducated to the position more in line with his own.

But that can't happen, all the more reason to tell us why we should listen to his failed reasoning.

In all of his posts, I never hear his plan. I hear the vagueness that is conveyed in terms like "ESTABLISHMENT LEADERSHIP", "REPETITIVE DIGGING ACTIONS", "STREET PIRATES", "ORGANIC SKILLS", "ORGANIC DEVELOPMENT CULTURE", and nonsensical shit like that.

Do you know any black people? I ask that seriously. Because in your post you sound like a person who may judge a group of people through tiny bits of circumstantial evidence that help you to convict a group of people in you own mind. I doubt that you interact with any blacks other than those who strictly share your views.

Are you a man or an insolent child? Because if you are a child that would explain the bloated faux importance and silliness that you infest this site with on a nearly daily basis. I now understand what your sole purpose is here - tomfoolery. That's kinda sad. I actually feel sympathetic for you.

I have never seen or encountered a person who tactically has nothing positive to say about the community of which he is a part of. I read this site daily. Field has posts that lift as well as point the light of introspection and self knowledge at ourselves. We celebrate or achievements and work on our issues in a "constructive" manner. But every time there is a post which paints a black person in a negative light, you are only too happy to jig your ass up and chime in. But when there is a post on a topic of black achievement, Such as the kids in Chicago, there is nothing to be heard from you. Are you embarrassed by black success? Does it not fit your narrative? Would you rather the children in the urban centers commit crimes, hence proving your "street pirates" thesis correct? Do you think that every black child that succeeds takes away from a more deserving suburban white kid?

This is what I don't like about people like you.

Somewhere, some 50+ year old, pot-bellied, wheelchair bound White degenerate juxtaposes a picture of a well-kept Black family, with an underlying "motivational" message about how they are "killing" America....and that makes sense to him.

Your actions aid and abet a person who thinks like this, directly or indirectly.

See, C. Wingnut, the problem isn't with the average Black nuclear family, the problem is with you, and people like you. The contradiction is the problem; the debate you seem to be having within yourself. Which 'problem' is it: the savage "North American street pirate" who's image you overpost lovingly, ad infinitum; or the progressive Black American? Can they both possibly be the same, or is what you constantly propose an oxymoron?

There are just too many Blacks doing too well, statistically, for that to be true. Too many of them doing better than you, or your avatar, Mr. 50 year old disabled White SSI recipient.

In summation, taking the time to create a bogus mental picture featuring a crime-ridden, impoverished subculture and then not being able to adequately formulate a plan to fix the problem you propose DOES NOT make you look particularly intellectually savvy, in the know, or credible. Just makes you look misinformed, ignorant, and like you live in an insulated bubble away from everyday American reality. makes you look like you live in your mom's basement somewhere in East Point, Conyers, or.....Lithonia?

Constuctive Feedback is a black Frank Drackman.

Gregory said...

"Constuctive Feedback is a black Frank Drackman."

I wonder which of the two is going to feel most insulted...

field negro said...

But that can't happen, all the more reason to tell us why we should listen to his failed reasoning.

In all of his posts, I never hear his plan. I hear the vagueness that is conveyed in terms like "ESTABLISHMENT LEADERSHIP", "REPETITIVE DIGGING ACTIONS", "STREET PIRATES", "ORGANIC SKILLS", "ORGANIC DEVELOPMENT CULTURE", and nonsensical shit like that."

Sadly TSC,I think you might br right. Still no answers from the [un]constructive one. Just more of the same vague, ambiguous,generalized, pull yourself up by your boot straps, rant.

"See, C. Wingnut, the problem isn't with the average Black nuclear family, the problem is with you, and people like you. The contradiction is the problem; the debate you seem to be having within yourself. Which 'problem' is it: the savage "North American street pirate" who's image you overpost lovingly, ad infinitum; or the progressive Black American? Can they both possibly be the same, or is what you constantly propose an oxymoron?"


CF, doesn't believe that there is a "black nuclear family" besides his own.

Trapped in SC said...

Did you guys see on Huffington post where the teabaggers were calling congressmen niggers and faggots on capital hill today?

Maybe CF was there.

Anonymous said...

TSC, "Constructive Wingnut is not a wingnut, he's fascist-lite.

The only ways that his fanciful theories abut black achievement, or his declaration of it's lack thereof, can work is in a world where all of the criminals, all of the welfare recipients, all of murderers, all of the murdered, all of the immoral, all of the incapable, all of the lazy, all of the troublesome, and all of the burdensome are eliminated, neutralized, or reeducated to the position more in line with his own.

But that can't happen, all the more reason to tell us why we should listen to his failed reasoning."

You don't understand much of anything do you? No wonder you are still trapped in SC..too dumb to find a way out.

You do nothing but attack without reason. You prove beyond doubt that you love to berate and degrade your fellow brother for thinking different from your fault-finding "lying" racist dumb ass.

You are a disgrace to your race and rank among the world's top ignorant fools.

Constructive Feedback said...

Mack Is Lying:

I apologize to you. I had saved off so many objectionable comments from Mellaneous that I forgot your comments and one of his as well.

First let me dispense of another Mellaneanism:

Capitalists don't feel these emotions.

What Mellaneous doesn't realize is that after just listening to the Congressional Black Caucus state that this health care package will be the 4th trophy that the progressives will have on their shelf (Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid) that I SEE THEM AS Demand Side Economy CAPITALISTS.

You see Mellaneous when I see a report which says that these 3 programs and NOT DEFENSE SPENDING are the main forces that is GOING TO cause this nation's bankrupcy and yet they are APPLAUDING them - it is clear that these LEFTIST forces are the perfect compliment of the Wall Street insiders who brought us "Credit Default Swaps" and other kaboki accounting tricks that costs the US Treasury so much money 2 years ago.

These type of capitalists USE EMOTION to get what they want. They just did not have account in the schools that they attended.

Mack Is Lying
[quote]Is it just me, or are the wingnuts and GOP fanboys trying to bring us back to a pre-1929 "Gilded Age"? That's the point when the only people who were raking in the big bucks were the fat cats, and they set themselves up a Plutocracy, where only they and their fellow wealthy comrades benefitted. [/quote]

Mack Is Lying:

Do you mind if I frame this for you?
I see the importance for you, Filled Negro, Mellaneous, Low & Country, Gregory and a few others to BUILD UP THE REPUBLICAN REFERENCE POINT for you to argue against. (The diversionary straw man).

Here is how you should be thinking instead.

How does it feel, Mack Is Lying, to have your FREEDOM to-damned-day, where you and the people that you consider "your people" (be it race or ideological or community that you group upon) and yet in order for YOU to express their VALUE as being worthy of HEALTH CARE you have to tap LEGISLATION from the government to have this value recognized?

You see Mack Is Lying - despite having struggled to control the schools in Chicago, I just heard Rep Danny Davis of the Southside of Chicago speak on behalf of THE POOR and what this means to them.

Now keep in mind, Mack Is Lying - this bill, while SERVICING their needs for Medicare is popular among them - they have done NOTHING in the way of COMPETENCY DEVELOPMENT to bring to their community these heightened services. They tapped the "social contract" of the United States to expand their entitlement.

Let me ask you Low & Country - WHY did you take over these schools in these areas when they are all but IRRELEVANT in tying the process of ADDRESSING THE PEOPLE'S NEEDS to the presence of these MEDICAL NEEDS?

Do you see that the oldest trick in the book is to get the NEGRO to come into agreement with you by focusing upon:

* The Democrats
* White Folks
* Conservatives
* Corporations (Profits)

The sad part about this is that DESPITE the power that the Progressive ensnares as he successfully executes his ground game at the local level - there MUST BE some pain inside of all of you as you note that DESPITE THESE VICTORIES in the AMERICAN POLITICAL DOMAIN - you are no more CAPABLE to lever the HUMAN RESOURCES that you have as a loyal following to leverage the institutions that you now control to ALLOW THEMSELVES TO BE THE PRIMARY CARE PROVIDERS FOR THEMSELVES. Again USING THE SCHOOLS and the CULTURE that you now control to GUIDE THEM in this conscious manner.

I know that you are working hard.
I want to know WHO are you working FOR?

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]YOU have not been paying attention. read the latest CBO numbers, then slink back to your cave and brew a pot.[/quote]

maria:

You point to the claimed $1,000B in savings between 2020 and 2030.

I wonder if you also factor in the documented $10,000 billion run up in the national debt that all of the policies that have been enacted over the past year are scheduled to post?

US debt to hit $20 trillion by 2020
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2009/aug2009/debt-a28.shtml

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]So will the republicans give us this "dignity" you seek? Because someone has to be in control. Right?

Or are you saying that we should forget about the political institutions in place?
[/quote]

Filled Negro:

How can someone give you DIGNITY?
This comes from within.

Dignity is what you will REFUSE to do because of your standards, REGARDLESS of the gains that you might obtain from doing so.

With each violation of these STANDARDS, Filled Negro, you are no different than a WHORE who sleeps with men who she doesn't know their "disease status" but her need for money is greater than her desire to mitigate the risks to her. Your DIGNITY shrinks each time you lay down with the benefactor who is USING YOU for his own pleasure. He only needs to give you a bit of what HE HAS in excess because in doing so he has not fundamentally yielded his superior position. He merely gave you a 'maintenance payment'. YOU will be back on the street seeking another 'transaction' in due time.

It seems, Filled Negro that some of us have reached the point of degradation that we have come to mistake the "tactile simulation" upon the nerve endings of our genitalia that the "John" is performing on us for the same physical expression that a lost love who had deep concern for us used to do in the past. In these past times, Filled Negro, you yielded your body freely because there was your key expression of LOVE to have this blessed loved one "inside of you".

Today - with so much scar tissue upon your DIGNITY which numbs the connection between the nerve endings between your legs and your MIND that must process the electrical impulses - you merely GO THROUGH THE MOTIONS.

A "Yoda-like" figured who lives on the mountain of moral superiority named Mellaneous said "Capitalists feel no emotions"

I am inclined to agree with him - IF he accepts that all CAPITALISTS don't wear suits and work on wall street.

SOME are planted firmly in the "Demand Side Economy" in which THEIR SOCIAL JUSTICE NEEDS drive their draw upon the "social contract", the Treasury, and the debt service that must perpetuate the illusion.

THIS IS LOSS OF DIGNITY, Filled Negro

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]all of the burdensome are eliminated, neutralized, or reeducated to the position more in line with his own.
[/quote]

Low & Country:

You will never realize how valuable you are to me. Seriously.

You, Filled Negro, WhiteBowieSteve and others asist me in

1) Understanding the debate tactics of the vile "Attack Sheep Dogs" who defend the ESTABLISHMENT forces of the Black Quasi-Socialist Progressive Fundamentalist

2) What you like to obfuscate toward in order to "Put ME on trial" instead of you

3) Notate how you are ultimately IRRELEVANT to the fix that must be made.

Low & Country - here is what you and WhiteBowieSteve do in common:

When I attack YOUR IDEOLOGY it is to your advantage to make it out that I am attacking BLACK PEOPLE (the genetic representation of us).
In Group Propaganda 101 one learns that if you can maintain this fusino between the "genetic group" and the way an 'authentic member' should think then the people next to you are inclined to fight against the outside attacker.

Now keep in mind that just like the "All White Jury" of the past - it is your CONTRADICTIONS that prove to be your indictment.

When attacks are made upon Clarence Thomas or Michael Steele, despite the fact that the words that many a Black man heard just prior to his lynching by the "All White Jury" - it is UNDERSTOOD by the "Neo-All White Jury" that they are just talking about THIS ONE BLACK MAN or the sub-group - NOT THE WHOLE.

As I joust with you all my bookshelf of responses becomes more complete.

Here is a graphical image of WHERE I STAND. I wonder if YOU ALL are capable of doing the same based upon "knowledge of self"?

http://www.withintheblackcommunity.com/videos/BlackDomains.jpg


Low & Country is like WhiteBowieSteve's recent Tomming exercise. He came to a Black Conservative web site to ask that we talk about the Chicago Urban Prep Charter school and how 100% of its Black male seniors received college acceptance.

He wanted to leverage THIS as "Black Community achievement". what Steve FAILS to note is that Chicago - the "Democrat's Democratic city" has 409,000 students in their system; 87% are Black and Hispanic yet they graduate only 52.9% of them.

They want me to buy into the "YOU MUST SAY SOMETHING NICE because they are BLACK" scheme. This allows them to avoid the call for their own DISMISSAL because of the 47.1% of students that FAIL TO GRADUATE.

If we assume that there are 100,000 seniors in the Chicago school system and that this charter scool has 100 seniors - WhiteBowieSteve and Low & Country wants me to give a PAT ON THE BACK over the fact that 100 Black males graduated yet 47,000, mostly Black and Hispanic males WILL NOT GRADUATE.

It is clear that THEY ARE FRAUDS.
Allow them to speak for our community to our own PERIL!!! They both are "3 Card Monte" players, wanting us to keep our eye on the cards while Gregory bumps into us from behind and takes our communitys' WALLET.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]In all of his posts, I never hear his plan. I hear the vagueness that is conveyed in terms like "ESTABLISHMENT LEADERSHIP", "REPETITIVE DIGGING ACTIONS", "STREET PIRATES", "ORGANIC SKILLS", "ORGANIC DEVELOPMENT CULTURE", and nonsensical shit like that."[/quote]

I REST MY CASE about Low & Country.

NONSENSICAL SHIT LIKE THAT!!!


Filled Negro:
As a criminal defense attorney who is in court and has just viewed the testimony of a GUILTY defendant......he has SPOKEN and removed all doubt in the minds of everyone in the court room as to his guilt per his OWN WORDS........WHAT IS YOUR TACTICAL STRATEGY after ward?

The only 2 people gunning for him are:

* YOU - becauase of the profit motive

* HIS MOMMA - because despite the fact that she too knows he is guilty - she believes that if she proclaims his INNOCENCE enough - others might believe her.

This Street Pirate stabbed his girlfriend 60 times. Despite his sentencing on Thursday both MOTHER and GRANNY stuck to their belief that HE IS INNOCENT!!!! IF ONLY he had Filled Negro as his lawyer. He might be on the street right now.

http://www.myfoxatlanta.com/dpp/news/Family-Talks-About-Daughter%27s-Brutal-Murder-031510

NSangoma said...

~
For you punk tea-parting MoFo'n fuelz:

Tea Party Protests: 'Ni**er,' 'Fa**ot' Shouted At Members Of Congress
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/03/20/tea-party-protests-nier-f_n_507116.html
`

Black Diaspora said...

Part One

MeandMyMicroscope said...
"While I'm in favor of health care reform, I'm NOT in favor of this bill. The following groups of people are entitled to free health care IMHO:

1) Children and college students up to age 25.
2) The unemployed
3) Poor/middle class elderly ONLY.

Smokers should NOT get free healthcare, and people who are overweight without a medical cause, shouldn't get free healthcare either."


You're not alone in this assessment of how health care should be delivered and to whom.

And without making you wrong, I'm going attempt to make a case for a no-fault system of healthcare delivery.

I'm going to extend your list to include a whole bunch of others with risky lifestyles: those who drink, drive their cars too fast and recklessly, eat too much fast food, don't eat enough healthful food, are couch potatoes, climb mountains, water ski, snow ski, drive cars in need of repair, sleep too much, sleep too little, eat food with too much sodium, ad infinitum.

Unhealthy lifestyles, and an unhealthy environment, as well as unhealthy food--all contribute to poor health.

Just living is an unhealthy proposition. We start dying from the day we're born. We say we're living. Actually, we aren't living, we're dying--second by second, minute by minute, and hour by hour.

Sure we can rail against those whose lifestyles are inimical to a long life, and place an undue stress and burden on society.

But where do we draw the line? How do we determine who gets health care, or pays more for it, when there's so many factors that need considering, not the least of which is location?

Having children can be a costly affair. Should we stop poor people from having children because the children may grow up to be a bigger financial drain on society, than their parents?

How about addicts, regardless of how they became addicted? Should we pay for their health care? And how about the children of addicts, who enter life with a possible host of physical and mental deficiencies?

Black Diaspora said...

Part Two

And those with birth defects that make them dependents for their entire life on the largess of society?

How about those with AIDS, and those who practice unsafe sex, or at risk to contract any number of STDs?

How about those born with genetic predispositions to all sorts of potential health issues? Medical science is advancing to the point that we can determine this very early on in the life of a person.

I could go on.

I don't think those countries with universal health care winnow out those who unhealthy lifestyles may contribute to the quality of their health, or may tax the system more.

Because health care is available to all, the opportunity to shape behavior through education becomes more likely than not.

Because we all, many through no fault of their own, have lifestyles that don't contribute too the best health possible, I say extend it to everyone equally.

It's cheaper and easier than looking for all the health factors that may militate against good health, identifying them, and denying those persons health care on those bases.

Let me expand the discussion briefly. If we think of the health of a nation as an individual responsibility, rather than a collective responsibility, it's easy to discriminate against those whose lifestyles we oppose.

When we see health care in terms of a societal body, a collective body, then we will do whatever is within our power to improve, maintain, and sustain that body.

Because we see it as an individual responsibility, we, in turn, can deny health care to twelve million people (undocumented workers) who contribute to the well-being of our society, and who are deemed unqualified under this legislation.

The "general welfare" goes beyond the individual, and focuses on what's in the best interest of all, and how that "welfare" may be maximized, rather than minimized.

This kind of focus on health care benefits all. This is why we inoculate children against a variety of childhood diseases, and why we geared up this past year to fight and conquer swine flu.

We could have inoculated only those who possessed acceptable lifestyle habits, and made acceptable lifestyle choices, but we'd have to bury a lot of people as a result.

Anonymous said...

NSangoma, thanks for the link to huffington post. I think Trapped in SC mentioned it but he was either too selfish or too dumb to provide a link...

Racism is an evil thread that runs through the fabric of American society. It is part of the DNA in the psyche of our nation; and cannot be removed.

The tea baggers prove that it's never been about the Healthcare bill, it's been about the color of Obama's skin.

Jody said...

Black Diaspora... well said

field negro said...

Still no answers from CF. Just more of the same. Sad. :( Methinks he has been hanging with the "party of no" too long.

Trapped in SC said...

You stab logic 60 times every time you make one of those pointless-ass posts, dude.

You have nothing.

And you know it.

At least the wingnuts and teabaggers you emulate know why they don't like black folks.

I've called you out on this numerous times, Constructive Wingnut; even pointing out how redundant and oxymoronic your posts are, and how refusing to help solve a problem (the "black progessive" in America) is a cop out for someone who would cease to exist if the "problem" did. Yet, you won't refute that logic. And you continue to try to create the same monsters you claim so vocally to wish to slay.

Constructive Wingnut.....until you volunteer to teach underprivileged Black children chess up in Harlem; volunteer to teach Chinese immigrants English in Doraville; become a "hugger" at the Special Olympics over by Druid Hills; or help promote Native American awareness by donating thousands of dollars to the Cherokee Indian council (Gateway Pow Wow) as I do.....then YOU are the fucking problem, not any Nigger on Earth.

You.

The TOM formerly known as 'Constructive Wingnut'. A wheelchair bound "self-fulfilling prophecy". A complete fucking circle. A stupid dog chasing his own tail around and around until he either gets dizzy; or temporarily realizes how futile his actions really are. Is that you, Constructive Wingnut? Yeah, I think so.

EVERYTHING WRONG IN AMERICA TODAY IS A DIRECT RESULT OF CONSERVATIVE THEORY AND ACTION.


And to the Anonymous bitches at 8:02, and 6:thirty whatever,

Tell you what, Hoss....why don't YOU bring back "Hangin' "? Show us how big your balls are. Set off the race war single-handedly. Or even better....STOP LIVING VICARIOUSLY THROUGH OTHER PEOPLES EXISTENCE. You'll never don a white hood; never hold the end of a hangin' rope; never speak ill of a Black/Hispanic/Asian/Jew on the train; never brandish a firearm/longbow/hammer of Thor/anything else in furtherance of the White race.....you'll do none of that. Simply because you are a coward.

Stop fooling yourself. Get off of your computer, put the Miley Cyrus picture down, put the baby oil in the medicine cabinet, walk out your basement, and tell your mother what you were doing.

Black Diaspora said...

Jody said...
"Black Diaspora... well said"

Thanks, Jody.

MeandMyMicroscope said...

Black Diaspora said...
Let me expand the discussion briefly. If we think of the health of a nation as an individual responsibility, rather than a collective responsibility, it's easy to discriminate against those whose lifestyles we oppose.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

First off, great speech. Second, too bad there isn't any realistic substance to it.

If YOU, out of YOUR own pocket are willing to fund Shenaenae and Becky as they game the system, be my guest because I for one, am not!!

I KNOW what's it's like to grow up so close to poor you can smell it, so I made CHOICES in my life that would keep me from living that lifestyle. My CHOICES are the reason my family income went from low class as a kid to upper class now as an adult, CHOICES and let me add SACRIFICES!!!

This isn't about discrimination against folks who sport $200 Tims yet get a pissy attitude with my sister the Pharmacist, when they have to pay $5 (subsized by the Gov't) for their asthma meds. This is about people's need to be accoutable for their CHOICES!!!!

When my DH switched jobs a few years back and we had cobra for insurance, I didn't bitch about the $600/month payment because $600 doesn't cover the payment on my car!!! In other words, I don't live a hypocritical life, complaining about this kinda stuff because at the end of the day, I know I live the life afforded me by my CHOICES and am supremely blessed!!!!

Besieds, what's so wrong with paying a little more in health insurance when people are so willing to "bling out" on cars, clothes, and homes? Is not an investment in your own health not the smartest investment in the world? I get that not everyone can make the choices I make, which is why I include them in who should get free health care. But if the obesity epidemic is any indication, most people couldn't give a rat's ass about their health and the people left holding the bag so to speak, are the family of the individual and tax payers!!!

This has to change, so lets start small. Let's start by excluding smokers from ANY free health care plan. When enough people have to actually PAY for their medical bills related to this disgusting habit and DIE miserable deaths because of their behavior, things will almost certainly change!

Anonymous said...

MMM, "This has to change, so lets start small. Let's start by excluding smokers from ANY free health care plan. When enough people have to actually PAY for their medical bills related to this disgusting habit and DIE miserable deaths because of their behavior, things will almost certainly change!"

What about the people who are trying to quit but haven't been able to because they are addicted?

Why not have the tobacco companies subsidize medical bills?

uptownsteve said...

Trapped in SC 5:28 PM

bravo!!!!!

Black Diaspora said...

MeandMyMicroscope said... "If YOU, out of YOUR own pocket are willing to fund Shenaenae and Becky as they game the system, be my guest because I for one, am not!!"

I'm willing to pay for all the reasons I mentioned, and several I didn't.

Seriously.

Anonymous said...

I despise how people talk about casualties of the Iraq war and only mention the American dead. You never hear people being disgusted at the 600,000+ dead Iraqi civilians, but I guess white lives are worth more than brown ones in America, even on blogs run by a supposed field negro.

maria said...

MMM, being in the "medical profession" as you claim to be, i'm shocked you don't know that smoking is a form of addiction--ie, a MEDICAL CONDITION.

oh, wait, maybe it's really a CHARACTER FLAW.

i didn't bother to comment your "version" of healthcare reform because it was beyond idiotic. you clearly do not understand how medicare or medicaid work, and you want people in school to get free healthcare. talk about a high price tag--no one in their right mind would propose what you have.

but i digress--i already said i wouldn't comment because it was so idiotic. oh, and yeah, let's expand FEHBP. where have you BEEN? read much?

Anonymous said...

"I despise how people talk about casualties of the Iraq war and only mention the American dead. You never hear people being disgusted at the 600,000+ dead Iraqi civilians, but I guess white lives are worth more than brown ones in America, even on blogs run by a supposed field negro."

Americans are like that. They only care about themselves. It was the same story in Vietnam. This kind of self-centeredness will eventually catch up to America.

Anonymous said...

maria, "oh, wait, maybe it's really a CHARACTER FLAW."

what is, and how do you define CHARACTER FLAW?

MeandMyMicroscope said...

Black Diaspora said...
I'm willing to pay for all the reasons I mentioned, and several I didn't.

Seriously.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

And when this bill passes, I guess we'll all see how you really feel about it.

Anonymous said...

what makes you think it is going to pass?

Black Diaspora said...

MeandMyMicroscope said...
"And when this bill passes, I guess we'll all see how you really feel about it."

Frankly, for me, the bill doesn't go far enough. I was hoping for universal healthy care.

There's a segment of the population that does get universal health care (some better than others), free food, and shelter, and neither their character, nor their lifestyle is taken into consideration, as to who should receive it.

Almost 2.5 million people in this country receive this universal attention.

Unfortunately, or fortunately, depending on your point of view, this almost 2.5 million people also reside in our nation's penal institutions.

If we can do this for the worse of the worse, I think we can do it for overweight Shenaenae and chain-smoking Becky.

For what it's worth: I understand your point of view. I really do. It's one many hold.

Unlike many, I have a unique vantage point: I know what's at stake here, the big picture, and why every life is important.

So important in fact, that I'm willing to divvy up a little more (actually, a lot more) to pay for those who can't afford health care, have horrible lifestyles, and appear not to pull their own weight.

Phil4Real said...

Hey FN,
This is funny watching the clones go crazy.

Hey the teabaggers are complaining about the Healthcare Bill being shoved down their throats. Isn't that what teabagging means? LOL

MeandMyMicroscope said...

Black Diaspora said...
Unlike many, I have a unique vantage point: I know what's at stake here, the big picture, and why every life is important.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Like I said before, that's a great unrealistic view on life. And I can think of one group of folks who don't deserve it, child molesters. Those mofo's NEVER change and can't be rehabilitated. Kill them ALL, I say!!!

As for valuing the life of others, why should I when the lifestyle some people live say they don't value their own? Outside of mental illness, why should anyone give a damn?

MeandMyMicroscope said...

Black Diaspora said...
So important in fact, that I'm willing to divvy up a little more (actually, a lot more) to pay for those who can't afford health care, have horrible lifestyles, and appear not to pull their own weight.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Free college or post secondary education? I'd be VERY happy to contribute to that because more often than not, I'll get a "positive" return on my money.

Free health care for everyone? I'd rather not throw my money away, because a significant percentage of folks in society don't care about their own health!!!

California Girl said...

Sadly and more appallingly are the death threats on the internet. This one just in on Twitter via The Political Carnival blog:
http://www.thepoliticalcarnival.net/2010/03/tweet-well-surely-get-over-bullet-to.html

I will never understand the hate in this country.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]EVERYTHING WRONG IN AMERICA TODAY IS A DIRECT RESULT OF CONSERVATIVE THEORY AND ACTION.[/quote]

Low & Country:

I have learned that it is no use attempting to force a person to climb out of his hole of ignorance.

If you believe this is the case I have no alternative but to accept your perspective, regardless of how ignorant it is.

We can smoke you out of your position merely by noting your reaction to the prospect of having your enemy MOVE AWAY FROM YOU and thus you living your life how you choose - implementing any progressive policy that you desire.

Come back in 5 years and we will note that there has been a new faction of CONSERVATIVES created in your midst. It was necessary for your non-organic ideological theory to retain its unity in opposing something.

Constructive Feedback said...

Black Diaspora - I fear you more than you know. Since Jody seconded your thoughts you can add her to it.

I told of the serial suicide attempter. It is clear that YOU would be operating the stomach pump as you showed that you valued her life more than she did and you would spare no expense to prove this to her.

I sit back and read things like "No Fault Health Care" and I realize that per this policy the people that YOU will demand to carry out this policy (via their funding) are the main people who will seek to avoid THE ROBBERY. You, Jody and Mellaneous will be at the ribbon cutting ceremony as you self-congratulate the fact that your altruism has been spread to cover more of the "least of these" REGARDLESS of what they have done to bore a hole below your standards.

Black Disapora - WHY NOT MIGRATE TO MEXICO and apply your theories?

Do you see that there is a massive GAP between your THEORIES and the ECONOMIC SYSTEM that can instantiate them.

IT DOESN'T MATTER TO YOU. You are simply into the MENTAL MASTURBATION of what you have typed.

[quote]Let me expand the discussion briefly. If we think of the health of a nation as an individual responsibility, rather than a collective responsibility, it's easy to discriminate against those whose lifestyles we oppose.[/quote]

Can we also conclude that their LIFESTYLE is what DISCRIMINATES them from the run of the mill person who's RISK FACTORS are less than theirs?


[quote]When we see health care in terms of a societal body, a collective body, then we will do whatever is within our power to improve, maintain, and sustain that body.[/quote]

Stunning. I can only imagine what will happen when SOCIETY reaches the point that it is in their best interests to sustain this BODY, cutting off the cancer cells?

[quote]Because we see it as an individual responsibility, we, in turn, can deny health care to twelve million people (undocumented workers) who contribute to the well-being of our society, and who are deemed unqualified under this legislation. [/quote]

[quote]
The "general welfare" goes beyond the individual, and focuses on what's in the best interest of all, and how that "welfare" may be maximized, rather than minimized.
[/quote]

STUNNING!!!!

The most scary part of it all Black Diaspora is that you can only see how to accomplish this GENERAL WELFARE via THE GOVERNMENT. Just imagine if the GOVERNMENT LEAVES YOU ALL ALONE?

Anonymous said...

BD, "Frankly, for me, the bill doesn't go far enough. I was hoping for universal healthy care."

I am in agreement. Well at least this will be a beginning toward universal healthcare?

Black Diaspora said...

@CF: "Black Diaspora - WHY NOT MIGRATE TO MEXICO and apply your theories?"

Going against my better judgment, I'm going to engage you CF. We're so diametrically dissimilar, that a discussion of what separates us is not only inadvisable, it's downright masochistic.

Why should I "migrate to Mexico"? Many enlightened and socially advanced countries are already doing what you're opposed to doing here, and are doing it better:

"Universal health care systems vary according to the extent of government involvement in providing care and/or health insurance. In some countries, such as the UK, Spain, Italy and the Nordic countries, the government has a high degree of involvement in the commissioning or delivery of health care services and access is based on residence rights not on the purchase of insurance."

"Do you see that there is a massive GAP between your THEORIES and the ECONOMIC SYSTEM that can instantiate them."

No theories, realities. See aforementioned quote.

"IT DOESN'T MATTER TO YOU. You are simply into the MENTAL MASTURBATION of what you have typed."

Hmmm! Now who comes to mind when I hear those words, "Mental Masturbation"?

Oh, I know: Constructive Feedback!

"Stunning. I can only imagine what will happen when SOCIETY reaches the point that it is in their best interests to sustain this BODY, cutting off the cancer cells?"

It's been tried before. It was in Hitler's Germany. Remember: around 6 million Jews were exterminated.

Is it your suggestion that we go back to this method to rid society of undesirables?

"STUNNING!!!!

"The most scary part of it all Black Diaspora is that you can only see how to accomplish this GENERAL WELFARE via THE GOVERNMENT. Just imagine if the GOVERNMENT LEAVES YOU ALL ALONE?"

And what do you suggest? If a private effort will accomplish universal health care, I'm all for it.

But there are too many like you, and others in the Republican Party, who will resist any effort to remove the profit motive wedded to our health care system.

The two are incompatible. That's why so many are filing for bankruptcy to sustain their health or the health of their family members, small businesses are struggling to keep their workers healthy, and not growing as a result, and many more are dying each year because they're uninsurable for a variety of reasons--can't get insurance because of preexisting conditions, or being dropped from healthcare rolls, because their medical care is not cost-effective enough to continue.

I'm glad you fear me, CF. I represent an existential leap for humankind.

I'm evolving. Each day I'm becoming more than I was yesterday: A Highly Evolved Being. A HEB for short.

You, I fear, represent a dying breed. A dying mindset. A dying attitude toward others, and the world in which you live.

The world is changing--and for the better. It's scary for some to see that, especially if they're invested in the status quo, more invested in keeping things as they are, a conservative mindset, or seeking to incrementally change things using old models, rather than new ones.

I've examined your model. It's still vested in old assumptions, and old constructs.

It's a "contingency management" approach, when what is needed are totally new constructs that look and what we, as a society, wish to achieve, and then fashioning a methodology to achieve it--methodologies that are alway evolving as our needs change.

Change should become the new principle. When people tell me they're standing on principle, I'm assured that they're living in the past, relying on outdated models, and are willing to use those models either to arrest change, or develop policies that don't take change into account.

You, my friend, are slowly becoming anachronistic. And you know the shame of it, the utter sadness of it? You don't even know it.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]That's why so many are filing for bankruptcy to sustain their health or the health of their family members.......[/quote]

YOU ARE INCORRECT ON YOUR ANALYSIS.
Let us frame this properly for you:

People are filing for bankruptcy because they are seeking to CONSUME a Standard of Living In Health Care that their INCOME does not allow them to afford.

Stop right there Black Diaspora and re-read that a few times.

When YOU discuss the "shared national burden" for Health Care all you are saying is that you wish to step in and change the VALUATION of one's LIFE in reference to the PAYMENTS FOR SERVICES RENDERED. Thus the physicians interest to receive compensation for his advanced and rarefied knowledge and must be SUPPRESSED because your system demands that he value his patient's life more than his own interests.

Black Diaspora - If I told you that this sounds very "Cuba-like" this would likely not offend you at all. Would it?

In your brand of Kabuki Economics that which is not affordable by the INDIVIDUAL will be made affordable once you proclaim it as an intractable NATIONAL BURDEN. You must then go after the private property, nationalizing these resources in order to PAY FOR what had been unaffordable by the individual.

Keep in mind Black Diaspora - this is not about Health Care. H.C. is yet one more front by which you and others show yourselves. My goal at this juncture is to "Show yourself TO yourself".

Let's think through this a bit more Black Diaspora.
You reference the UK, Spain, Italy and Norway. Can I get you to agree that IF this were on a different topic that you would point to the past actions of these nations in the GLOBAL SLAVE TRADE and European conquests? This got ENRICHED because they STOLE from others and enslaved them. But this is besides the point.

Do you find it ironic that most of the nations on your list are listing from their present financial circumstances?

Greece is in the news yet the UK's debt PERCENTAGE is nearly that of Greece's. Italy

Italian Debt 115% of GDP
http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory?id=10127859

UK Debt - NOTICE ALL 3 CHARTS!!!
http://www.creditloan.com/blog/2008/10/30/americans-debt-to-income-ratio-as-compared-with-other-countries/

Black Diaspora - you indeed are a "Demand Side Economist". Not only do you force someone else to figure out how your grandiose altruism is going to be paid for - You fail to note how the people will continue these ENTITLEMENT RIGHTS once the economic system that you pointed to as the key enabler CRASHES AND BURNS.

field negro said...

Let's think through this a bit more Black Diaspora.
You reference the UK, Spain, Italy and Norway. Can I get you to agree that IF this were on a different topic that you would point to the past actions of these nations in the GLOBAL SLAVE TRADE and European conquests? This got ENRICHED because they STOLE from others and enslaved them. But this is besides the point."

Now just when i thought CF was trying to have a reasonable and civil debate with BD, you go and make the above comments. That is a straw-man if I ever saw one, and a totally useless point.

"...And what do you suggest? If a private effort will accomplish universal health care, I'm all for it.

But there are too many like you, and others in the Republican Party, who will resist any effort to remove the profit motive wedded to our health care system.

The two are incompatible. That's why so many are filing for bankruptcy to sustain their health or the health of their family members, small businesses are struggling to keep their workers healthy, and not growing as a result, and many more are dying each year because they're uninsurable for a variety of reasons--can't get insurance because of preexisting conditions, or being dropped from healthcare rolls, because their medical care is not cost-effective enough to continue...."

BD, you win that little debate with the [un]constructive one for those comments above.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]BD, you win that little debate with the [un]constructive one for those comments above.[/qutoe]

Filled Negro you'll never know how much you are exactly like your brothers and sisters in the "All White Juries" of the past. Every ruling is meant to reinforce your establishment order.

I am struggling with one point that I keep hearing from Progressive-Fundamentalists like yourself. You all have a common hatred for PROFIT.

In my calculation the opposite of profit is DEBT. When we consider a business and it is wildly profitable you are among those who are attacking the CEO.

At the same time when I see GOVERNMENT DEBT racked up in the name of social justice it appears that the larger the spending the greater the proof of CARING.

You are not hearing me Filled Negro. I am identifying you and other leftists as CAPITALISTS. While we identify the Wall Street types as being CAPITALISTS, drawing upon the Federal Treasury with their schemes to maximize their interests- you too make such a draw upon the federal treasury as you seek to maximize your interests.

It is the job of the government to defend its jewels from theft by BOTH OF YOU - Wall Street and the Progressive-Fundamentalist.

Think about it Filled Negro - the biggest long term threat to you receiving health care is not some "Tea Bagger" standing on the stairs of the hospital and calling you "Nigger". Instead it is the day that the financial kabuki theater that you and others have erected come due.

At this point my dear friend Black Diaspora will recognize that backing her altruism IS INDEED a harsh system of economics that she did not fully consider. Thus this is why Chad or Laos cannot WILL itself "Universal Health Care" because they mandate it as a "human right".

Black Diaspora said...

Part One

@CF: "In my calculation the opposite of profit is DEBT."

No, in my calculations, using my metrics, the "opposite of profit" is non-profit.

Every person is worthy of his hire, but as long as health care is delivered primarily for profit, rather than to improve patient health, then profit trumps health, trumps quality of life, and, from time to time, trump life itself.

That's not acceptable. Health care should not be tied to market vagaries, and profit motives, but delivered at cost.

"At this point my dear friend Black Diaspora will recognize that backing her altruism IS INDEED a harsh system of economics that she did not fully consider...."

You talk about these things as though they're mutually exclusive, incompatible.

Altruism, as you're wont to describe it, is not inimical to sound business practice, or economic good sense. They can exist simultaneously.

And those businesses that practice both are not only on a sound financial footing, but the thrive as well.

"At the same time when I see GOVERNMENT DEBT racked up in the name of social justice it appears that the larger the spending the greater the proof of CARING."

In that case, Wall Street should be feeling a huge amount of love (Big Love) from Washington, given all that "caring" they've recently received.

For your information, I don't approach any of this from a "social justice" mindset.

Providing universal health care not only makes good horse sense, it makes for a better society, and a better society makes for a stronger country, and a stronger country makes for a happy people willing and prepared to move toward greatness, improving life here at home and abroad.

We will find that it will give us a competitive edge in the marketplaces of the world, and show the world what a unified society can accomplish.

Black Diaspora said...

Part Two

E Pluribus Unum is not only good for a handful of loosely connected, but independent colonies, but for people as well, regardless of their ethnicity, cultural identifications, or social standing.

You'd have us stand alone, and think that this is the way to forge a new 21st century world.

The new world emerging has all it need in place to move beyond the old construct, the old model--the Internet playing a big part in that--allowing for the creation of new alliances, new cooperations, new affiliations, and a new unification, not unlike the interconnectedness that we see in nature's model--our ecosystem.

If we don't start mimicking this model, one that has worked for eons, we will become as extinct as the Dodo bird.

Nature forces interconnectedness, and cooperation upon the various entities in its midst.

Only man would seek to go beyond nature's dictates, and force it to its will, rather than cooperating with all that live in a mutual beneficial manner that assures survival.

The days of rugged individualism are over. We will one day measure our greatness, not by how much wealth a few amass, but by how much we're able to give to all those necessities that elevate life, and pre-serve it.

You won't hear this. You can't. You're stuck in the old way, the old attitudes, the old mindsets that says if I succeed, then my task is over.

In truth: Your task isn't over until all succeed, whether it's health, education, or those things we say allow all people in our society to pursue happiness as they define it.

We are society and society is us. What is needed is a social, political, and economic ecosystem, where the interrelatedness, and interconnectedness of these various elements are respected and assured.

When these elements aren't seen as one (that is, related), we get what we now have, a financial system that threw caution to the wind while it greedily earned undeserved and ill-gotten monies while the nation struggled to survive.

And our political system aided and abetted this fleecing of America, which compelled society (tax payers) to bail out those who create the mess in the first place.

We can't survive unless all these elements are seen as one, operate as one, and interact as one.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]No, in my calculations, using my metrics, the "opposite of profit" is non-profit.[/quote]

LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL

Black Disaspora - is it true that on occasion CEOs in NON-PROFITS are compensated with big dollars?

as long as health care is delivered primarily for profit, rather than to improve patient health, then profit trumps health, trumps quality of life, and, from time to time, trump life itself.

Black Diaspora:

Do you see how you are frustrating to me?
When I move to an environment where THERE IS NO FINANCING that can bring forth your VALUE OF LIFE - it seems that despite your high regard for HEALTH CARE - it never comes to pass.

Black Diaspora - when you heard Nancy Pelosi claim that the legislation that was passed yesterday EXTEND MEDICARE - did you make the linkage between the FINANCIAL REALITIES of Healthy Care and your notions?

When the SW Atlanta Medical Center shut down due to FINANCIAL reasons did the fact that it was already a NON-PROFIT have it abstracted from fiscal reality?

I FEAR YOU because I know that you have NO RESPECT WHAT SO EVER for my PRIVATE PROPERTY in the quest for YOUR goals?

[quote]
That's not acceptable. Health care should not be tied to market vagaries, and profit motives, but delivered at cost.


Black Disapora - if YOU and Mellaneous formed a Non-Profit which effectively took high school kids and guided them through MED SCHOOL - where they later worked for merely a LIVING WAGE - I would spiritually support you.

Constructive Feedback said...

Black Diaspora:

I just read your part 2.

I think that you fail to understand my position.

I am granting you open access toward any of our young people that need direction, GETTING INTO THEIR EAR and having them transform their lives into being the collaborator that you speak of.

Get those people who worked for free for Obama to apply the very same spirit in getting their degrees and doing the same for society.

Please, by all means WRITE ME OFF. If you listen to Low & Country - I am like an old man in a log cabin talking to himself.

Instead I am viewing you based upon your ability to attract those who have no clear opinion. USE THEM without building up a negative strawman to motivate them

alicia banks said...

yes

and hobamacare will cause more children to suffer

poor uninsured children will still be uninsured/restricted to a newly gutted fed care...

children of working parents will suffer will more of their parents lose nullified employer insurance/jobs/homes/are jailed/fined

yes

hobamacare is all about suffering for children and adults who do not own pharma corps!

Vernon Malcolm said...

With today's computer machined steel stude technology, a new building is cheaper and better than renovations. The only reason one engages in atomistic, sheflish small business is to avoid following the rules. Even Milton Friedman showed that small business creating jobs is unprovable because of survival bias (J Eco Lit, Vol. 30, No. 4, pp. 2129-2132). In today's complex New Industrial State (J K Galbraith), you do a better job if you are a large contractor because you have all kinds of compliance controls in place and access to superior information than if you are on you own.

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