"54 people were arrested in France as of Wednesday for “apologizing for terrorism” in the wake of the attack on the Charlie Hebdo office last week that left a dozen dead. French authorities also announced the country would crack down on what the Associated Press summarized as “hate speech, anti-Semitism and glorifying terrorism.” The 54 arrested were rounded up for making or defending terrorist threats in the last week; some have already been sentenced under emergency guidelines.
One person hauled in was Dieudonné M’bala M’bala, a controversial French comedian who sympathized with one of the Paris gunmen in a Facebook post. “Tonight, as far as I’m concerned, I feel like Charlie Coulibaly,” he wrote, mixing Charlie Hebdo with the last name of the man who took hostage a Jewish deli. He has since deleted the post.
Dieudonné (his stage name) has been convicted of anti-Semitism under France’s harsh laws against anti-Semitic speech; his stage show was banned last year for Holocaust jokes. He gained international notoriety after he popularized a Nazi-like salute that was then made by French soccer player Nicolas Anelka.
Government spokesperson Stephane Le Foll said France was also considering Patriot Act-like measures, including wiretapping, to further combat terror plots — as well as urban projects to fight inequality, where it feels violence and hatred foments." [Source]
??????????
OK, I thought they just had a big "freedom of speech" rally in France.
Shouldn't all speech be free? Or is this the French equivalent to crying fire in a crowded theater?
I guess all "free speech" isn't the same.
Let's see how many pundits, comedians, and celebrities now come to the defense of Dieudonné M’bala M’bala. Because, sadly, as offensive and despicable as this guy is, he should still have the right to speak freely.
I just think that it's kind of ironic that the right-wingnuts got all over the Obama administration for implying that a cartoon could have sparked some of the anger over Benghazi, and that some of the same people are now saying that radical extremists shouldn't be allowed to kill people and cause terror because of an offensive cartoon in a print publication.
Just watch those "Patriot Act- like" measures people, sometimes they can have "unintended consequences. "
60 comments:
There's freedom and then there's "freedom." You are free to bash Muslims but you're "free" to bash French sacred cows.
Only the scary mooooslims are not afforded free speech.
At your own risk.
Selective free speech?
Fields,
You are such a lost soul it is not funny. Your are imprisoned by your own anger. It clouds your thinking. Sadly, in this self made prison, you are the ony prisoner and the only guard.
Toyota Devins
Good lord you lefties are stupid and insane. The phucking story you are commenting on nimrod is Muslims killing people AGAIN because they don't want free speech.
Go ahead keep finding ways to support murderous jihadis....coward.
Fields is just an asshole. No analysis beyond this is necessary.
"OK, I thought they just had a big "freedom of speech" rally in France"
There is no freedom of speech in Europe, that's an American thing. In Europe there are people in jail saying something rude about an important person, for questioning facts about the Holocaust and for pointing out that Muslims are a little more prone to terrorism.
What Hollande is doing right now is competing with Netanyahu over who loves French Jews the most. An "anti-semitic" remark will get you in deep shit in France.
Charlie Hebdo, that paragon of "free speech" fired their satirist and cartoonist Siné in 2008 for saying that Sarkozy's son "will go far" after he converted to Judaism when married a Jewish heiress. The remark seems innocuous by any standards. But the editor Philippe Val ordered him to apologise. And when Siné didn’t, Val, editor of the magazine that published nude pictures of Muhammad and cartoons of Jesus being sodomized by God, gave him his marching orders.
So you are correct Field, all "free speech" isn't the same. You just don't which animals are more equal than others.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/4351672/French-cartoonist-Sine-on-trial-on-charges-of-anti-Semitism-over-Sarkozy-jibe.html
know
That is definitely an ironic and funny situation.
There is simply no way to have "hate speech" laws and still have meaningful freedom of speech. It just doesn't work.
I don't agree with everything that Charlie Hebdo did, and I really, really don't agree with this Dieudonné guy -- he's pretty overtly anti-Semitic, including doing quasi-Nazi salutes to piss off Jews -- but charging people with offensive speech is a bad way of handling bigotry.
This freedom of speech thing has gone too far. It hurts people very deeply and expects them to take whatever insults they hand out. Somehow, there is something wrong the picture of freedom of speech. There is no responsibility or consideration behind it.
Freedom of speech can be used irresponsibly...words can be wickedly hurtful to those who hold sacred values for their religion.
How does on justify trashing someone's religion under freedom of speech? There is something very self-ish and unreasonable about that.
Maybe people have taken freedom of speech too far? Maybe humans who believe in freedom of speech aren't mature and compassionate and 'respectful' enough to handle freedom of speech responsibly?
Believe it or not, words can hurt, and cut right to the soul...That's how wars start.
I'm also irked at all the right-wingers saying that if you don't feel like showing cartoons of Mohammed -- which I see as offensiveness for its own sake -- then you don't support free speech. This is nonsense. I don't have to agree with what someone says in order to believe they have a right to say it -- and for sure that they shouldn't be killed for offensiveness.
Charlie Hebdo was a far-left-wing organization. Will Fox News now be taking a brave stand that racial profiling is wrong, in support of Charlie Hebdo, because that was what the Charlie Hebdo staff supported?
Here is a Charlie Hebdo cartoon about that subject:
http://bit.ly/1ASgfRt
Charlie Hebdo also considered the military to be nothing but a bunch of murderers. I fully expect conservative media outlets to endorse that position, since apparently agreeing with Charlie Hebdo's politics = freedom of speech.
In this cartoon the caption reads "14 Juillet [France's Independence Day], the killers' holiday.":
http://bit.ly/1Cor4dN
In this Charlie Hebdo cartoon, the caption reads "France doesn't have oil, but she has an army!" and shows a murderous French soldier's face as he prepares to loot the Middle East:
http://bit.ly/14ZBZQX
Dear Yisheng, I ran across this article and thought you might be interested in it:
DENVER — "A new pot spray promising to help women have better sex will hit the shelves in Colorado next week.
Foria, which contains marijuana extract, claims the relaxing properties of cannabis will help women have better and more satisfying sex. It's been available for a few months in California, but only to people with a medical marijuana card and doctor's recommendation.
The edible coconut oil-based spray — users spritz it on their genitals about 30 minutes before sex — goes on sale to the general public in Colorado next week at an Aspen marijuana boutique.
Foria, from Aphrodite Group, a California medical marijuana cooperative, is the latest in a burgeoning line of marijuana-infused products, from lotions to candies to patches. And while there's little scientific evidence to back up their efficacy, scientists say marijuana's long history of use gives significant credibility to the concept."
I wonder if Whitey owns a piece of this business? CA can really dream up some way out shit.
Dear Brother Field, you need to do a post about this. Or maybe not, if you are one of the owners. Did Whitey call you about this?
I bet Bill and Kinky wish they had a piece of the action. But, this is left-wing business.
I understand that Charlie Hebdo's latest cartoon edition circulation has gone from its normal of 60K to 3mil! They say it has Mohammed the Prophet on the front cover. I really wish they would leave Mohammed alone so there can be some peace in Islam and in France.
I wonder if the number of Jihadists have grown in proportion to Charlie Hebdo's magazine circulation?
Quite a few countries in Europe have this problem. They're so "progressive" and so intent on operating nations based on feelings that they disarm their police yet give their justice systems to power to imprison people based on mere words.
If you live in Sweden or the UK, you better go on the lam if you offend a Muslim. And apparently France won't let you offend a Jew.
And let's be honest here: We know how this starts. When we publicly crucify the Donald Sterlings of the world and demand their jobs because what they say just drives us all so utterly angry for some reason, we're right on the doorstep of legislation.
After all, if Field said something offensive tomorrow and lost his job, half the nation would pump their fists and scream about how a "freedom of speech" isn't protected in the private sector. We'd explain it away by people being allowed to punish those how they see fit. But what we don't see is how close this is to legislation.
With millions of Americans carrying torches to run those who say offensive things out on a rail, how easy will it be for government to say, "Okay, let's start making this against the law"? It will be incredibly easy. It can be passed through one of those 1,200-pagers Congress turns out, with muddy language, and next thing we know we have people going to prison because they say "Islam promotes terrorism."
We're right on the doorstep here in the good ole USA. We're already demanding blood every single time we get offended by words. It's only a signature away from putting people in jail for such.
And the tragic trajectory would insist it's closer than we think. Democrats are falling over themselves to make America more like Europe. Well, careful what you wish for.
The next time you call Bernie Goldberg a right-wing hate-filled shill, you might be doing 2-4 in a federal prison. (Though maybe not. Our initial hate speech laws will only make it illegal to offend racial minorities. lol)
There was a rock band in Russia called "Smegma." They ended up in Siberia for interrupting a Circumcision Ritual in a synagogue. They were yelling bad stuff about Putin and the secret police got them.
Regular rubbing is great for your pole and for your hand. Don't worry if sweat builds up while rubbing. But if necessary, it helps to wipe the pole with a dry cloth or towel. Then keep rubbing. Don't stop until you're done.
You can also wipe the pole with cheap wipes - you should use the ones that have added lanolin or vitamin E. Slippery oils are good for your pole. Using wipes on your pole or even on your hands can add a bit of grip to the pole. Keep one hand near the box of wipes for the finish.
Rings should be removed before you rub your pole. If you have a good pole, you don't want to scratch your skin. That's very bad for the pole and will bring an unpleasant stop to rubbing your pole.
Donald Sterling was banned for life from the NBA within 48 hours of a tape surfacing of an illegally recorded conversation where he dissed blacks. His company was taken away from him and he was condemned all the way up to the white house.
Tony Parker did a Nazi salute on the basketball court. Danny Green took a selfie at the Holocaust memorial in German and did a #lolholocaust hashtag.
Dalmon Young assaulted a homeless man in an anti-Jewish hate crime. There were witnesses. He was convicted and did no time in jail and suffered no lost of job.
The media was obsessed about Sterling while the other 3 combined got close to zero coverage. The NYT did over 30 stories on Sterling and zero on any of the 3.
Yes, SOME people have more freedom of speech without consequences. Apparently it doesn't bother blacks when it is them.
Jesse Jackson called Obama a nigger and said he should be casterated. He seems to have gotten a significantly more free pass than Ted Nugent, Paula Deen, Michael Richards, Don Imus, etc. Are you upset about this discrepancy or is it only a problem when it doesn't benefit blacks?
Pastor Jones was jailed to prevent him from insulting Islam. Any reason you are infuriated that a black man in Paris can't incite violence against Jews but a white man can't diss Muslims without being imprisons? Jones is no worse than Farrakhan or the black Hebrews. I don't see any outrage over them. He's not even as bad as Sharpton whose racial hatred led to the firebombing of a business which killed 7.
Oh, that's right, the largest population of Muslims in America are black. Jones also wasn't a Trayvon supporter. Now I see the difference.
Most of you people, with some exceptions, are idiots.
We must DESTROY the ISLAMIC radicals NOW.
No question. No regrets.
@Toyota Devils, I made bail a long time ago.
Anon@2:42, was that the infamous "Pussy Riot"?
Problem isn't so much speech but nut job religions. The fact that dopey humans are still following ancient bronze age mythology (Islam, Christianity, Judaism you name it) in 2015 is unbelievable.
field negro said...
Anon@2:42, was that the infamous "Pussy Riot"?
We have "occupy wallstreet" protests and other countries have "pussy riots" in the streets.
Thanks Obama.
Gotta love those rich white hollywood dumbocrats.
Even for the Oscars — even for the Oscars — this is a really, really lot of white people. Every nominated actor in Lead and Supporting categories — 20 actors in all — is white.
http://www.npr.org/blogs/monkeysee/2015/01/15/377406709/at-the-oscar-nominations-its-a-good-year-to-be-an-idiosyncratic-man
It's white, "even for the Oscars."
Maybe this is the year the Oscars celebrate white actors.
Eric Zemmour was imprisoned for pointing out blacks are disproportionately involved in drug dealing. Any reason FN didn't mention that in France minor slights towards blacks, Arabs and Muslims resulted in the same punishment? Didn't work for the anti-Semetic angle. It's nice that when a black man kills 4 people for being Jewish instead of any shame or condemnation blacks start whinning that another black male who encouraged more attacks was arrested. I will remember the (non)empathy blacks showed the next time some negro is on the receiving end of a similar crime. It is amazing that blacks didn't emphasize the race of the shooter or that he shot people because of their race and what they were wearing on his head just like Trayvon. Oh that's right Trayvon wasn't shot for either but these people were. Black hypocrisy never ceases to amaze me.
This is the first shooting in a long time which has gotten a lot of press where the race of the shooter wasn't emphasized in the black media. Hmmmm. I wonder why the race of this "comedian" or the man who killed for Jews in the hate crime in the Kosher market is downplayed by race obsessed blacks. I am sure if a member of Ayran Nation had committed a similar atrocity against blacks you would never have brought up the shooter was white. Or if it was a Jewish comedian who laughed about dead negros. The next time some silly negro gets killed in a hate crime I will be sure to ridicule it on a college campus in America. You know, one of those colleges that allow "free speech" by allowing Nation of Crackwhores on campus.
Freedom of speech would be curtailed within 5 minutes.
If FN wants to protest selective censorship I would be glad to help him fight the blacklisting of anyone who doesn't have an altogether positive opinion about a group of people who make up 4% of the population and commit over 50% of all murders.
If this attack had been Jewish on black the response from the black community wouldn't have been to point out all the murders that are committed in Africa then complain that Donald Sterling was overly punished for slights against blacks and quickly want to move on.
For a race that demands so much compassion you sure lack it towards others.
Well Josh if it becomes illegal to offend minorities that will certainly be a step up from the random (or not so random) MURDER of Blacks for minor criminal offenses.
@11:42, Asians commit 50% of all murders? Damn I didn't know that.
# Mathisnotfor uneducatedracists.
No, negroes do.
#STEMisnotfornegroes
U.S. jobless claims rise to four-month high
(Reuters) - The number of Americans filing new claims for unemployment benefits last week increased to the highest level since early September, but the underlying trend continued to point to a strengthening labor market.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/15/us-usa-jobless-idUSKBN0KO1HJ20150115
People filing for unemployment keep rising.
Only in the Obama Recovery is rising unemployment claims considered pointing to a strengthening labor market.
Yīshēng said...
# Mathisnotforuneducatedracists.
===
Whether or not an individual can succeed in a modern, technological society depends on the abilities of that individual. Since we live in a society free from racial discrimination, this means any individual with the ability is free to succeed.
Therefore in America you will see black doctors, scientists and writers who stand with the best white or Asian representatives of these professions. Just not as many.
Because although we see equality among individuals of different races, we will never see equality between racial groups.
This is because the standards of achievement and behavior collectively established by individual whites are a standard deviation greater than what individual blacks can collectively achieve.
Living in a society where it is difficult for you to thrive is frustrating, humiliating and ultimately debilitating. If you are told it is the fault of others you will be angry. Lost and angry people commit more crimes.
This is why blacks will always be underrepresented in some areas and over represented in others, like prison.
If you can't understand that, then you have no business calling yourself educated.
Yīshēng said...
MURDER of Blacks for minor criminal offenses.
My education is music and food, yet I understand that routine driving/parking tickets has serious consequences for poor people. A speeding ticket that Field Negro would write a check for might be out of the budgett for a poor person. The ticket goes to warrant, and then that poor person that was speeding is now wanted for not paying his ticket. Pay up or go to jail.
MINOR criminal offenses become felonies.
MSNBC is reporting on the magical shape shifting jews...
“I talked to a cross section of mainly French Algerian young men who said it was pretty much they felt the attacks were actually a conspiracy by the Jews to make Muslims look bad, and they told me that, one person told me that in fact they weren’t just regular Jews that were doing this, in fact they were a race of magical Jews, shape-shifting Jews, that were master manipulators and could be everywhere at the same time.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=guLqk7h3s_U#t=56
Yisgeng, for the murder of blacks, look to your own folk.
While whites may occasionally put down a black in the street, blacks are pretty much culling other blacks as if they're a fox infestation in the UK.
This black comedian openly threats to kill Jews after another black man just killed 4 Jewish people for being Jewish. Not a word of sympathy from black Americans for this black on Jewish hate crime. Instead Black Americans have no shame that another black man is doing everything possible to openly encourage more murders of Jews and instead claim this is no different than drawing a religious icon as a cartoon. And then black Americans gripe about pro-Jewish bias. Shame on you. And blacks then wonder why so many are losing sympathy for you and your plight. So much compassion for yourselves so little for those you victimize.
Shouldn't all speech be free? Or is this the French equivalent to crying fire in a crowded theater?
In America we have freedom of speech to mock religion. A white guy was arrested for hanging a noose in a public place though. If someone posted on social media encouraging people to shoot blacks, and this came right after a serious hate crime against blacks, it would be prosecuted.
-----------------------------
I guess all "free speech" isn't the same.
Yes, openly encouraging people to kill more Jews right after a massacre against Jews is not the same as drawing a cartoon of a religious icon. I'm sure you would see the difference between drawing a cartoon of Buddha and burning a cross on a black families lawn, no?
--------------------------------
Let's see how many pundits, comedians, and celebrities now come to the defense of Dieudonné M’bala M’bala.
No need to. One can support prosecution for trying to incite murder but not for drawing cartoons of religious figures. No hypocrisy there. The hypocrisy might be with blacks like you who are framing this very different than if you were the victims and the perp was white.
----------------------------
Because, sadly, as offensive and despicable as this guy is, he should still have the right to speak freely.
In France encouraging violence is not freedom of speech. Just like in America encouraging assassination of the President is not nor is burning the cross on a black person's lawn freedom of expression.
-----------------------
I just think that it's kind of ironic that the right-wingnuts got all over the Obama administration for implying that a cartoon could have sparked some of the anger over Benghazi, and that some of the same people are now saying that radical extremists shouldn't be allowed to kill people and cause terror because of an offensive cartoon in a print publication.
What irony? Your statement above makes no sense what so ever.
Yeah yeah yeah, Bill tell that to the widow of Eric Garner.
Josh "my own folks" are Black, White, and Native American.
So I'll just focus on White since in the last 500 years, NO OTHER RACE has killed more people than Whites.
Yeah.
Wingnut anon above, do u have a link to support your claim about the arrest of the guy for "hanging a noose in a public space"?
Was it because he was hanging a noose or because he was trespassing?
Just curious.
Yīshēng said..
So I'll just focus on White since in the last 500 years, NO OTHER RACE has killed more people than Whites."
We are better at everything. Except basketball, sprinting, and begging.
Anonymous White racist said...
Except basketball, sprinting, and begging.
>>>>>>
Except compassion, humility, fairness, and contrition. In fact, I could come up with a thesaurus laden post filled with what racists lack.
Heal thyself, Yisheng.
Cyanide thyself, goobernon.
Get em Doc.:)
Wingnut above I am still waiting on that link......
While you are waiting on that link, check this one out:
https://www.phillypolice.com/crime-maps-stats/index.html
91 percent of known homicides suspects since 2007 have been non-white.
91 percent.
Blogger Yīshēng said...
Cyanide thyself, goobernon.
4:14 PM
-----------------
Yisheng, why are you being so mean to our white brothers and sisters? If they weren't coming to FN, this blog would end up folding.
You make me ashamed. You're the reason we aren't moving up.
Blogger field negro said...
Get em Doc.:)
4:39 PM
--------------
Field is another reason we can't get ahead.
It's people like Yisheng and Field that the Academy didn't award any Blacks this year. They are tired of being insulted by Negroes like you two.
Whoa! I visited someone's blog whom I respect and I found this scary Scripture:
UNIVERSAL LAW
Psalm 14: 1-7
1 The fool has said in his heart, There is no Yah. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
2 The Sovereign looked down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any that did understand, and seek Almighty.
3 They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one.
4 Have all the workers of iniquity no knowledge? who shall eat up my people as they eat bread, and call not upon the Sovereign.
5 There were they in great fear: for Almighty is in the generation of the righteous.
6 Ye have shamed the counsel of the poor, because the Sovereign is his refuge.
7 Oh that the salvation of Yahuthim/Israel were come out of Sion! when the Sovereign bringeth back the captivity of his people, Yacob shall rejoice, and Yahuthim/Israel shall be glad.
-------------------
In the past, I have wondered 'why' I should fear God instead of just loving Him. Now I know. I continue to sin.
"Only in the Obama Recovery is rising unemployment claims considered pointing to a strengthening labor market."
Idiot.
One week in which unemployment claims went up does not invalidate a long-term trend of week after week in which unemployment went down.
Either math or honesty is not your strong suit. (Pick one.)
"Yes, openly encouraging people to kill more Jews right after a massacre against Jews is not the same as drawing a cartoon of a religious icon. I'm sure you would see the difference between drawing a cartoon of Buddha and burning a cross on a black families lawn, no?"
No, Dieudonné's comments are not on the same level of offensiveness as Charlie Hebdo's cartoons.
Charlie Hebdo refused to follow the tenets of a religion they don't follow (blasphemy to certain Muslims, but not to a bunch of atheists like the cartoonists.) I think that's pointlessly rude to adherents of Islam, but it's not on the same level as laughing at the murders of someone of another faith.
However, Dieudonné's commentary is also not equivalent to burning a cross on a black family's lawn. Our legal system has (rightfully) interpreted the latter behavior as not merely offensive but an actual threat. That particular cross-burning doesn't mean "I don't like black people," which is just offensive. It means "get out of this neighborhood or we will hurt you."
Specific threats are NOT protected speech -- they are assault. You don't have a right to never be offended. You do have a right to not have people threaten you with violence.
I would assume Dieudonne's comments fall under hate speech laws or "incitement to terrorism." Hate speech laws in France are quite strong and completely necessary. For example, a member of the national front received a 9 month prison sentence, hefty fine, and her party received an additional fine of 30000 euro, for mocking the justice minister based on race. Charlie Hebdo mocked racists and Islamophobes as much as they mocked Islamic fundamentalists and religious conservatives. Their targets were ideas and beliefs, not people. From what I gather,there lies the difference.
"I would assume Dieudonne's comments fall under hate speech laws or 'incitement to terrorism.' Hate speech laws in France are quite strong and completely necessary."
I am sure they do fall under France's speech laws. I don't, however, agree that such laws are necessary. I feel they are, in fact, a stupid and counterproductive reaction to bigotry.
"While you are waiting on that link, check this one out:
https://www.phillypolice.com/crime-maps-stats/index.html
91 percent of known homicides suspects since 2007 have been non-white."
But none of them threw their infant child off a bridge like Frisbee.
Carry on.
Still waiting on that link.....
Anon 9:09, counter productive how exactly?
Crimr stats among CRIMINALS??
Only idiots focus on that.
Why not focus on criminals/murderers that haven't been convicted yet, like Wilson.
"controversial French comedian"
If this French comedian's obsession was mocking and openly encouraging genocide against blacks I don't think that phrase would be used.
Encouraging genocide and threatening to kill people is a crime in France but drawing a picture of Mohammad isn't. And you see a double standard? I don't think you'd be seeing it that way if all of this was directed towards blacks rather than by blacks.
"So I'll just focus on White since in the last 500 years..."
You sound like one of those progressive lunatics who say, "We can't blame Islam for having its radical elements without pointing out the Christian crusades!"
When you have to dig back into history to make a point, perhaps you don't have a point.
Unless, of course, we're living in a world where white people are immortal and are all running around as 974-year-old bigots who were responsible.
See, this is a standard I cannot even pretend to understand. Black guy steals something, but mustn't say that's a "black" thing. That's stereotyping. White guy kills someone, must say that's a white thing, even if it happened in a world pre-automobile and pre-medicine. Let's dig in the way-back machine and remind everyone.
But, of course, you also have a cut-off point on your standards. This is obvious. For instance, when speaking about slavery, you'd obviously not use the millions upon millions of white slaves kept by Roman masters, through three wars and many emperors and dictators and expansions. No. Your way-back machine doesn't go back throughout "history" per se; only to where it's convenient enough for you to make a point.
No doubt white civilizations past were responsible for many atrocities, particularly against those who evolution wasn't very kind to in way of intelligence enough to mount a defense against savagery. It's a horrific stain on humanity, and I suppose we're to use previous millennia as a legitimate reason not to speak on blacks culling other blacks in today's America.
"They not as bad as whitey was!"
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/monkey-cage/wp/2015/01/18/french-hate-speech-laws-are-less-simplistic-than-you-think/
I recommend reading this for some context instead of doing what most of the commenters here seem to be doing: namely, holding up the US approach to hate speech as the only legitimate approach.
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