This post is a follow up to my previous one. And let me say right off the top that I got some interesting comments from folks who questioned the importance of calling out the blogger who runs the interracial site, and my need to see her actual picture.
For the record, some of you raised some good points. And I totally get how some sisters could see a double standard, especially when they claim that they have gone to sites run by brothers only to see sista bashing on a regular basis.
But here is the deal. (And I am going to my house Negro field Negro analogy again so stay with me) The house N
egroes among us tend to be more caught up on physical appearances and looks. You all know it, and so do I. I don't know, maybe it's because there are so many mirrors in the house. But these individuals are obsessed with the European concept of beauty and how it relates to the American experience. Usually, it manifests itself in two ways. One is the I don't fit into the Euro centric standards of beauty so I hate myself. (See Clarence Thomas) The other is the I fit perfectly into the Euro centric standards of beauty and I don't like people in my race, because they don't fit in like I do. (See Angela McGlowan) Both of these types of house Negroes are victims of their own devices and both are equally flawed.
egroes among us tend to be more caught up on physical appearances and looks. You all know it, and so do I. I don't know, maybe it's because there are so many mirrors in the house. But these individuals are obsessed with the European concept of beauty and how it relates to the American experience. Usually, it manifests itself in two ways. One is the I don't fit into the Euro centric standards of beauty so I hate myself. (See Clarence Thomas) The other is the I fit perfectly into the Euro centric standards of beauty and I don't like people in my race, because they don't fit in like I do. (See Angela McGlowan) Both of these types of house Negroes are victims of their own devices and both are equally flawed.I have said it here before, and it's worth repeating: I really don't care if two people of different races genuinely fall in love with each other and decide to hook up. They are human beings, and their race will sometimes take a secondary role to their basic human instincts. But when a person feels that they can only hook up with a person who looks like the other people in the majority population because of their own lack of self worth, or self hatred, well then we have a problem. And for the record, this standard applies to both black men and women. (O.J. Charles, and all you other black athletes with the white women just for having a white womans's sake, this means you)
This is why I wanted to see what this individual looked like. I wanted to get a better idea of what camp she falls in. Not because I wanted to judge her based on her looks. (That would be rather shallow of the field don't you think kitty?) Or, for that matter, because I thought the individual might be white. Frank
ly, I suspected it was a black female all along. And for the record, if you have what basically is a dating site with pictures of all different types of couples (celebrity and otherwise) and you purport to be living the lifestyle that you are promoting; well then, yeah, you should have your damn picture or likeness on the site. It's just that simple.
ly, I suspected it was a black female all along. And for the record, if you have what basically is a dating site with pictures of all different types of couples (celebrity and otherwise) and you purport to be living the lifestyle that you are promoting; well then, yeah, you should have your damn picture or likeness on the site. It's just that simple.So girlfriend, (If you are a female) you are a house Negro. And if there are brothers out there with sites bashing black women; well, then, they are house Negroes too. Promoting openness and tolerance is one thing, bashing your own race because of your own fucked up pathologies is quite another.
I hope I clarified why I posted what seemed to some of you to be a petty post earlier. There is nothing petty about the house Negroes running around among us and undermining our race. They must be called out at every turn. I don't care if they are celebrities, wanna be celebrities, or just some sista on the Net looking for "Mr Goodbar". Or, in this case, a vanilla flavored "Mr. Goodbar". If you are house Negro who prefers the comforts of the house, that's fine. But please don't try to spread that shit among other Negroes. Lord knows we have enough problems as it is.
***DISCLAIMER. None of the pictures posted above were meant to be (or have) the likeness of the individual who happens to be the subject of this post. If it just so happens that there is a true likeness of her (or him) in one of the pictures posted above, it is purely coincidental. ***
66 comments:
I (think) I've read the blog you are referring too and I think the author has dreads and is milk chocolate colored. I could be wrong but that's what I remember from reading her blog earlier this year.
Here's my thinking on interracial relationships. It's weird to me that black women would take offense at black men of all classes comfort level with dating non-white women.
Instead of the gnashing of the teeth over losing another black man to the other, why not start seeking out companionship that is genuine and life affirming?
The trade off may mean less African American couples and familes but that is the trade off for SBFs who want love/affection/companionship in their lives and aren't willing to wait for their African American dream guy.
Yeah, it's unfortunate that this blogger feels that knocking black men as a collective is the only way for black women to start explore their dating pool.
She should stop that but she shouldn't stop letting black women know that their are options (international too!) when it comes to dating.
I don't blame her for not posting her photo on her blog. I heard she gets death threats. She could be endangering herself by posting her photo. I don't post mine because I don't want the people I know to know about my blogging unless I tell them. Employers look up their workers so I kind of think people who use their real names and photos are asking for trouble.
I think this house and field negro thing is really destructive in Willie Lynch fashion. Why create divisions. Can't Black people be different with different tastes, backgrounds, and hang-ups without being called race-traitors? Some of us are damaged and make choices for less than rational reasons. But who is exempt from that? Every person, even a so-called 'house-negro' is doing things the best they can given their thinking and upbringing. In my opinion, the only thing that will change this behaviour is learning, more self-knowledge, and experience. It takes understanding by others too because these house-negros are probably very defensive. Seriously, the more people like this are criticized the more they will be convinced that they are right about Black people and they made the right choice not to date them. I don't think there is any real point arguing with them about it either. Its like trying to convince a straight person to try being gay, some people might be curious and try it, but some people just don't feel its right for them. Maybe thats not the right example. What I mean is that based on some people's experience they see interacial dating as the only way and they don't feel comfortable with their own. It will take a lot of dedication and experience for them to change. Its like unbrainwashing a lifetime of attitudes and preferences. This is going long but I'm just trying to say...people are different, its probably better to just accept that and work with or around them then try to change them. Its very difficult to change people who do not want to change.
Peace,
For me, the problem arises when those who date "outside of the race" feel the consistent need to make disparaging remarks about same sex members of their own race. We've all heard the criticisms before: "Black women just don't understand me." "White men know how to treat women better," etc.
If you like white men or women, more power to you. Do your thing. Just don't try to make it seem as if you've gone in that direction because something is wrong with the men and women who look like you. Take some ownership of your decision.
FieldNegro said, I wanted to get a better idea of what camp she falls in.
Allow me to help you out. She falls in the camp that is anti-black male. Talk to M. Fisher for full details. He and I did an entire blog talk radio program on this very topic.
What tickles me is the fact that she imagines that white men are the saviors of black women all of a sudden.
Now, I bet that's news to white dudes. I know they get a real chuckle out of the very thought of that.
BronzeTrinity said:Why create divisions. Can't Black people be different with different tastes, backgrounds, and hang-ups without being called race-traitors?
FieldNegro, see my comment in your original post on this subject. Look for my name (Lynn). The comment above represents the apathy present in the black community.
Evia's blog is less about interracial relationships than it is about her hatred of black men and her brainwashing black women into joining a "movement" against black men whom she claims are "damaged beyond repair". And she MEANS that. She's not joking.
Now if a black man started a blog to describe black women as "damaged beyond repair" and to accuse black women of being a "waste of protoplasm" I'd be equally offended at him and his diseased mind.
Evia and her followers are diseased. And these pitiful people you have sitting here telling you to just grin and bear it are the REAL buckdancers, jigaboos and house negroes and jockies you complain about all the time.
It's not the famous coons and house negroes that are hurting the black community. In my opinion, it's the ones at work and next door who do the most damage.
Sad you don't appear to see the forest for the trees. I'd run these weak beings off my blog "Harriette Tubman" style. No patience with them. Glad you don't mind conversing with them.
Black women are capable of making the decision for them selves. Wouldn't need Evia's help. I get the impression that interracial relationships are still unique to her and she certainly think her's is. Another thing she doesn't take into account in her proselytizing is that the same demographic that is single black woman is also single white woman. After thirty every woman's probability of getting married plummets, so black women are going to step in an arena where the competition is already stiff.
I dislike her pushing the idea that IR dating is going to solve the single black woman's problem. Her whole approach is setting those women up for disappointment. The black male bashing and the premises of the white male being intrinsically a better person, is a recipe for entering bad relationships. If there is no scrutiny or looking at one's own motives; there would be no preparation for the long run, when the crap of life hits the fan or that ugly head of racism rears up.
This is the damage she does.
Lynne proves my point. Anyone who isn't vehemently opposed to interracial dating is called a race traitor or any other negative variant on that. I don't read the interracial blog. But whatever, its not a big deal to me who other people date and I like to treat other people the way I want to be treated. I wouldn't want someone to say such harsh things to me just because of who I date or marry so I don't do it to other people. Its not like interacial dating is going to end the Black race or something. I think the infighting and lack of solidarity and understanding will probably be our downfall. In my opinion, the people who are really upset about interacial dating have their own issues. They feel personally rejected every time they see a Black person with someone who is not even though they are strangers. They covet other people's partners and demand access to them just because they are the same ethnicity. Face it, some people want you and some people don't. Quit crying that they don't want you and find someone who does already. Unless you want a harem then only one partner's choice of you really matters anyway. Next thing you know you'll have Black people advocating that laws against interacial marriage come back and people get jailed for it. This is backwards progress people but it sounds like thats what you want. So why not start up a petition to reinstate those laws? Then this pesky problem will be solved for you.
Did anyone watch meet the press this morning?
turns out the black america has bigger problems!
I guess that includes grammar problems.
Field, baby bubba.
Are setting an excellent example by being married, and married to a black woman.
Or, are you just out there laying pipe, er, dating? And the colour of the pipe receptacle does not matter?
`
As lynn said above, do you really think white men will welcome black women with open arms???
That's a question I'd like someone to touch upon.
Society has never treated white women and black women as equals. What makes anyone believe that significant change has occurred.
I've grown up around a lot of whites and I know A LOT of them wouldn't. As children they joke about Blacks and then as adults they pull "I'm just not attracted to people outside my race" lines and use abstract liberal ideals to safely oppose affirmative action, reperations, etc...
It should be noted too that men generally place a greater emphasis on physical appearance than women.
Moreover, given the level of segragation in this country the likelihood of blacks and whites coming together is bound to be slim.
Generally speaking, on a group level, whites are fearful of any black progress. Right now because overt racism and discrimination is no longer tolerated they are apathetic toward blacks and black progress. On an individual level, I have no problem if a black woman finds love with a white man.
Let's just be real though, whites and especially white men aren't going to save anybody.
"Can't Black people be different with different tastes, backgrounds, and hang-ups without being called race-traitors?"
Ahh yes. But what they can't do is bash the rest of us, as if they are in some way seperated because of their own f*&#d up belief system.
"In my opinion, the people who are really upset about interacial dating have their own issues. They feel personally rejected every time they see a Black person with someone who is not even though they are strangers."
I doubt that, this is 2007, I am pretty sure most forward thinking people don't have any problems on the dating scene. I am not sure where that was going. I have yet to meet someone -black or white- who is jealous of interacial dating because they can't find someone.
I like how hathor approaches this blogger, because she exposes the fact that what she is promoting could be destructive to these women who think that being with a white man will take care of the baggage that she might be bringing to the relationship, or that her potential mate himself might have.
"I dislike her pushing the idea that IR dating is going to solve the single black woman's problem. Her whole approach is setting those women up for disappointment. The black male bashing and the premises of the white male being intrinsically a better person, is a recipe for entering bad relationships."
Amen sister.
August, what was on MTP this morning?
"Are setting an excellent example by being married, and married to a black woman.
Or, are you just out there laying pipe, er, dating?"
nsangoma, does it really matter? I mean unless I am dating YOU, I don't think that should be a problem for you now should it :)
Okay Field, I'm finally going to throw my nickel in on this whole subject. Most times, I try to withhold what I think about certain issues from being printed and permanantly saved on a blog. But I'm going to throw out my opinion on this. Keep in mind that my feelings on the matter are not rigid and unchangeable. I'm still learning about myself and learning about the world we live in.
Okay now that I've prefaced my comments with a disclaimer, I can move forward. LOL
Honestly, in the past, I've been one of those sisters that turn up my nose at brothas that date white women. I used to get sick in my stomach when I would see a brotha just acting to darn giggly and proud when he was with his white girl. It would just burn me up. And I would immediately classify the brotha as a sell-out.
But lately, I've decided to not be so one-sided on the issue. I realize that life is mor than race and ethnicity. And there could really be a reason why these people have decided to allow themselves to fall in love with someone outside of their race. (Yes, I said "decided to fall in love." Contrary to popular belief, love is not an accident waiting to happen. It is something that should be well thought out and entered into with common sense.)
I honestly believe that there are some IR unions that have been genuinely created with love, fairness, and respect. I really do think there are some brothas out there that have non-black women that they just fell in love with.
But here's my issue with IR and some of the people that engage in them. I hate it when brothas feel like they have to step on the necks of black women to get to their white women. I hate it when black women feel like that they have to bash black men upside the head before they can get to their white men. Why do we have to beat each other down in order to justify loving someone outside of the race? What's that all about?
If you are truly falling in love with someone, without having any wrong motive, then why do you have to take the time to tear down their counterpart?
Now for all the black sistas that think that white men are going to be our saving grace, you're kidding yourself. White men, in general, don't want no part of black women. They might want to F*** us. But they don't want to call you girlfriend and wife. *Keep in mind that I live in the dirty south and not on the west coast, where I hear there are some white men that actually like black women.)
So, what happens is that black women just end up alone. Or end up with each other... Yep, I said it.
I can't speak on other partsof the country, but out here where I live, more and more sistas have decided to turn to other sistas for love, financial support, friendship, and understanding.
I'm not gay bashing. I'm just pointing out that it is sad when you see middle age black women, making a decision to go gay just because they can't handle being alone, unwanted, and/or undesirable.
I know I'm going to get a lot of flack for my comment. But I'm just repping what I believe.
Pweace.
One more thing... I really believe that sistas are open to dating outside of their race. But men outside of the black race have to actually like black women first.
BronzeTrinity said, Anyone who isn't vehemently opposed to interracial dating is called a race traitor or any other negative variant on that. I don't read the interracial blog. But whatever, its not a big deal to me who other people date and I like to treat other people the way I want to be treated.
Oh, I get it. So the fact that Evia spends most of her time on that blog throwing slurs at black men and telling black women to get out before it's too late is no big deal. And her pal calling black men a waste of protoplasm is no big deal.
Wow, must be great when nothing is of consequence.
I agree with the person above who said that black women who are planning to run to white men as their solution to their problems are setting themselves up to get their feelings hurt.
Nothing is wrong with interracial dating and marriage. But do it without insulting your own people on your way out the door is all I'm saying.
Now I'm going to get off this brother's blog so he can return to his regularly scheduled programming.
I know a lot of people in interracial marriages, and I've seen both the good and the bad. One couple I know married for love, and they have a beautiful relationship. (He's white, she's black). One of the issues they had to deal with, from the beginning, is that there were some things about each other that they may not ever fully understand. They also talk about racial issues honestly (they don't do that color-blind stuff). They each have a great love and respect for their own race. He doesn't bash all whites, and she doesn't bash all blacks.
Like many of you said, the only kind of interracial marriages I don't like is the kind where the people are in it for the myths, or as an expression of denial or self-hatred.
The problem is that no one wants to hit the issues head on and discuss them frankly and safely, leaving the agendas at the door. The fact is too mant brothers are full of crap, snarky, immature, swaggering fools. Too many sisters are bitter and in denial. Too many black-white couple are indeed wrapped up in this self-absorbed "color-blind" nonsense. I don't think we can move beyond any of this stuff until people are honest with themselves and their own motivations.
I used the Tiger Woods example before and I stick by it. First on his bullshit self-view, and second on his dad's clear preference for the usual Asian war bride thing that's been the norm from 1898 to present day: since the US army, navy and marines have been in the Far East. A compliant non black woman who'll wash your clothes because anything's better than the shack back home...
Let me preface this by saying that I'm a former Philadelphian now married to a white guy. He's the first white guy I ever dated and the only guy I ever married. Let's just say my wedding pulled off the blinders about the attitudes of a lot of folks I thought were cool, of both races.
Having said that, I've seen that sister's blog. I haven't read all of her posts, but there is one premise that I agree with. On sheer numbers alone, we aren't getting married anymore as a community in many parts of the nation. Black women like that blogger didn't make this statistic up. We can go into the myriad of reasons why this isn't happening, but it doesn't negate that it isn't happening.
Where I differ with her is that in the parts of the nation where folks ARE getting married, over half are getting divorced. Getting married to a white man won't guarantee staying married. Only getting married with a purpose does that.
I'm not on the Bill Cosby Bandwagon or anything, but I think we are ill served to pretend that there isn't a marriage problem for many African American men and women right now. Not to mention the rampant corporate selling of the idea of the hypersexual, disposable black woman. A selling by people who aren't black.
I'm in social services and I have been for a little over a decade. I can say that there are people who believe the lies about black women, and many of them are black women raising sons.
I'm just saying, if even Jill Scott is putting out a song on her latest asking black men how they'd feel if all sisters were gone, there's something in the air. Ignoring it hasn't helped. Blaming it on others hasn't helped. (especially considering that we came out of slavery having to fight for intact families... and did it).
There are plenty of women like me, for whom inter-racial marriage isn't a cause. It's just the way it worked out. And I don't feel pressured to negate how good a man my husband is to prove my love for myself, my heritage and my family. I just know how I feel about us.
Of course one person's blog isn't a big deal. Do you think somehow her blog is brainwashing the world and that all Black women dating White men somehow read her blog and totally changed what they think? Please. Its just one person's opinion on one blog. Is she some sort of tv personality preaching this on Sundays? Does she have a club with thousands of members who pledge to only date interracially? Does she have a book? If not she's no big deal, just one of a million other bloggers.
And yes, from reading Black men's comments on different blogs about this they sound personally offended when Black women are with non-Black men. They state they feel rejected and it is another attack on the Black man. These are often married guys. Why would someone in a committed relationship care who someone else dates and why? When Black women state their standards they say they are hurt and that our standards are too high, yet those men are MARRIED! They want to be attractive to other women besides their wives so that they feel good about themselves. Thats taking it personally in my opinion.
All this fuss over the motives of some people do date others. I think it would actually help Black people if we found out the motivations of Black men, who claim to love Black women, yet choose to not marry them and have children all over the place. Why have some Black men decided to not marry? Why do they want to be players with a different woman every night? Why do they listen to music that endorses that mentality? Why have some of them decided they don't have to live with their children? Why have they decided that having sex without a condom is okay even though it spreads diseases and causes pregnancies? If these attitudes are corrected then some Black women will actually be able to find a good Black man and more of them would actually want one. That might again sound like Black man bashing but seriously understand, if a Black woman wants to GET MARRIED and she can't find a Black man who wants to GET MARRIED, then she will never GET MARRIED. If she thinks having a man's baby will mean that they will GET MARRIED, yet the man doesn't believe children are a reason to GET MARRIED, then she will never GET MARRIED to him. So these are reasonable concerns. If more Black men wanted to marry Black women, especially the one's who have their children then maybe these women wouldn't be looking elsewhere.
Has anyone read that article in the washington post? 'Marriage Is for White People'
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/03/25/AR2006032500029.html
I think marriage across the board is not attractive to a growing secular America especially with the high divorce rate, individual selfishness promoted in our culture and the fact that many percieve that they can get everything in a marriage that they can remaining single and just living together.
That article states:
The marriage rate for African Americans has been dropping since the 1960s, and today, we have the lowest marriage rate of any racial group in the United States. In 2001, according to the U.S. Census, 43.3 percent of black men and 41.9 percent of black women in America had never been married, in contrast to 27.4 percent and 20.7 percent respectively for whites. African American women are the least likely in our society to marry. In the period between 1970 and 2001, the overall marriage rate in the United States declined by 17 percent; but for blacks, it fell by 34 percent. Such statistics have caused Howard University relationship therapist Audrey Chapman to point out that African Americans are the most uncoupled people in the country.
I am not sure if this add anything to the conversation...but when I was dating a really nice guy who happened to be white...one of my black guy friends wanted to attack me saying "why don't you date a brother?" "you can't find a black guy good enough?" "you think you are too good?" and it is not like I went searching for a white guy after I broke up with my black boyfriend...and I was raised and all my black girl friends and I were talking about how we are going to stick to black men and I had a talk with all of the white girls in my dorm about why I prefer black men and that I am not racist for preferring black men...so I had reservations in dating this white guy...but is seemed to work out...
so anyways...back to my homie and his causations for why I am dating The White Man...I can honestly say that I responded with Black male bashing and stringing off statistics about black men in prison, HIV, homosexuals and college educated...so I felt bad...that I went there...but I think part of it was because I felt ashamed and a sell out for dating a white man...who I really liked and is really sweet...so there is a story to add for you all
The right winger say marriage is the key to social services. I say that's a lot of nonsense.
Would you want to be married to this? (I sent this comment to Nat Turners Revenge blog):
"A disc jockey has canceled his plan to allow light-skinned black women into a downtown club without a cover charge after angering civil rights activists and Internet bloggers who had heard about the promotion.
Ulysses "DJ Lish" Barnes, 27, said Friday he had received telephone calls and e-mails from people threatening protests and lawsuits.
"I apologize to whoever I offended," said Barnes, who described himself as a dark-skinned black man. "I made a mistake. I'm not perfect."
The "Light Skin Libra Birthday Bash" planned for Friday was a three-faceted event in which light-skinned black women, all Libras and people attending a club guest's birthday party were to have been admitted for free, he said.
Two upcoming Friday-night promotions that would have given "sexy chocolate" and "sexy caramel" women free admission to the club based on their skin color also were canceled, Barnes said.
"It was a bad idea. I admit that I was wrong," he told The Associated Press on Friday.
The club regularly attracts hundreds of men and women of all colors, he said.
Barnes said he began promoting the "Light Skin Libra Birthday Bash" about three weeks ago but started hearing from angry people after a copy of a promotional flier was published on the Web site MediaTakeOut.com.
Additional complaints from black activist and author Pearl Jr. and by representatives of the Rev. Jesse Jackson led Barnes to decide to cancel the promotion.
"Some people are telling me negative promotion is good promotion," he said. "I don't want to be in this position."
C Chambers is one of the few who've made an honest comment on the "entire" issue of blacks dating/marrying nonblacks (see here & Field's previous post). Most others have focused only on making damn sure black women know that noone else wants them (just in case you thought you had a chance in hell). I'm glad none of you are my parent--'oh baby no white man will want you, just become a dyke that's the best you can hope for' LOL.
And although FN & others here have conveniently slapped blinders on about the issue, many black men who date/marry nonblack women routinely slur black women--they even write books about their love of white women & hatred of black women.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but there are white & other men who date/marry black women (yeah sex is in the mix; who doesn't like sex). And, just like interracial dating opportunities for black men, the numbers will grow. I mean really if change didn't come wouldn't we all still be house/field negroes on plantations.
Field & others, if you really have a problem with what you believe are attacks against black men by this woman and not the fact that she's promoting black women dating black AND nonblack men, do what you do when black men attack black women. Slap your blinders on.
"In 2001, according to the U.S. Census, 43.3 percent of black men and 41.9 percent of black women in America had never been married, in contrast
to 27.4 percent and 20.7 percent respectively for whites. African American women are the least likely in our society to marry. In the period between 1970
and 2001, the overall marriage rate in the United States declined by 17 percent; but for blacks, it fell by 34 percent. Such statistics have caused Howard
University relationship therapist Audrey Chapman to point out that African Americans are the most uncoupled people in the country."
What is wrong with this picture?
I don't know if it's just me, but I have felt like this for a long time... The African American Family is in a crisis...
We can't continue to ignore the fact that 70% of our babies, our children, our jewels grow up in homes with a mama that's trying to pull the weight that two parents should be trying to pull.
I know that there are some bloggers that dedicate a lot of their writings to "What about our daughters?" But I submit, "What about our sons and our daughters?"
If the black family is splintered, broken apart, sick, fragmented, cracked, broken, then how will our children (both boys and girls) grow up seeing themselves and the world we live in?
Why aren't we getting married?
Why are most of my friends, even the ones that are not overweight, have a 700+ credit score, and don't have a bad attitude, still without a husband?
Why is that most of my college educated, sexy, financially secure, hetro brothas still not married in their 30's and 40's?
What the hell is going on here?
I don't buy the ain't no good, straight black men out here. That's a lie.
And I'm also not buying all black women are fat. loud, and rude. That's also another lie.
Yes, there are some down low brothas. But that's a terrible lie that was tossed on a lot of good brothas. And yes, there are a lot of big, rude, attitudinal black women. But all black women don't fall in those categories.
So, what's the real reason why black folks are not loving each other enough to get married?
Can someone help me with this?
Angie
Nuvision
"And although FN & others here have conveniently slapped blinders on about the issue, many black men who date/marry nonblack women routinely slur black women--they even write books about their love of white women & hatred of black women."
No blinders here, I have acknowledged that there are some f&#@*d up brothers out here bashing sisters and hooking up with white women for all the wrong reasons. I swear,some folks really see just what they want to see sometimes.
BT is this sister a friend of yours? Why the defense of her blog? She is out here blogging to the WWW and putting her stuff out there, so she had damn well better expect to be called on her bullshit! Hey, we all get it. Please believe that people call me out out on a regular, and I am fine with that. Blogging isn't for the thin skinned.
anon. thanks for sharing your personal experience and your honesty. Chris, you are always honest my brother, but sometimes you don't always get it right.
"The fact is too mant brothers are full of crap, snarky, immature, swaggering fools. Too many sisters are bitter and in denial. Too many black-white couple are indeed wrapped up in this self-absorbed "color-blind" nonsense. I don't think we can move beyond any of this stuff until people are honest with themselves and their own motivations."
Yes, too many but not all. In fact, those people you talk about represent a minority among us; I am sure of it.
And this sister using the bad apples to justify her own issues is just flat out wrong, no matter how you cut it.
"So, what's the real reason why black folks are not loving each other enough to get married?
Can someone help me with this?"
Loved your comments Angie. And to answer your question; just read some of the comments regarding this post and the previous one, and you will get a pretty good snapshot of some of OUR issues.
I guess the real question would be what't the point of getting married?
IMO some of the historical reasons for marriage just don't exist anymore, not to mention the many, many divorce horror stories that are out there and generally the man is always the loser either financially and if there is children involved.
The marriage conundrum is a very complicated issue and not a black issue IMO reason.
hey field, I just started reading your blog a few days ago and I must say that I enjoy it...
Let me just say that I think TRUE love has nothing to do with color. However, I think way too many black men/black women marry or date white people just b/c they think that a black man or woman isn't good enough for them.
I would never leave out the option of dating or marrying a white man but he also wouldn't be first on my list. In my relationships I want someone who UNDERSTANDS what I am going through on the day to day bases and how it is being not only black but a black female (the lowest on the totum pole in America). To me, a white man just can't understand that. He may be able to SYMPATHIZE but sympathy and understanding are two different things.
And to answer your question; just read some of the comments regarding this post and the previous one, and you will get a pretty good snapshot of some of OUR issues.
Field, I'm lost. Which comments are you referring to that give a good snapshot of our issues? Which comments point to the reason why we, Black Americans, are not providing a two-parent home for our children, why we are not valuing black love enough to make a life-long commitment, why we can't team our financial resources together to combat social/economical injustices?
And I'm not trying to be funny either. Point me to the posts.
I'll go back over them and read again, but I don't recall seeing no real answers to my concerns.
Angie
wow this is a good subject...although controversial as usual for you field. lol.
i happen to frequent this blog and am often disheartened by the comments that are said about black men....but i can't say that i completely disagree with her about some of the things she says...specifically regarding the whole media image of black women and the perpetuating of it by some black men.
i do think she can go about getting her views across a different way...and i definitely don't like the fact that she has basically put all white men on a throne and deems them the best thing since sliced bread.....that's kinda crazy....and completely untrue. seems to me there are far far less white men willing to marry a black woman than black men. whew.
Thanks 1990, always feel free to step in and comment.
"Field, I'm lost. Which comments are you referring to that give a good snapshot of our issues? Which comments point to the reason why we, Black Americans, are not providing a two-parent home for our children, why we are not valuing black love enough to make a life-long commitment, why we can't team our financial resources together to combat social/economical injustices?
And I'm not trying to be funny either. Point me to the posts."
Angie,I am not pointing to one post in particular, but look at the differences and the lack of of a consensus about our real issues.
If we can't get on the same page when just discussing certain issues regarding our relationships, what makes you think that we are going to do the right thing when it comes to dating each other and being in long lasting committed relationships?
And marcus; I co-sign with you on the marriage issue.
Well Angie you can do everything you just stated without being married.
FN, I read over the comments again, and I don't see what you're trying to say is the snapshot of the picture. Help me see! Maybe I'm blinder than I thought. LOL
Angie
Angie, I am looking at a snapshot of our over-all disagreements on this issue.
Some reasoned and civil, some seem to be not so reasoned and more passionate.
Get it? :)
Okay Field, you were answering my question as I was posting my last comment.
Thanks for answering... But I'm still left unsatisfied with what the answer is.
White folks are on different pages and all over the place too. But they are getting married. What is up with us? No, really, what is up with us?
A
"Well Angie you can do everything you just stated without being married." Anonymous
Really? Do tell...
A
Some reasoned and civil, some seem to be not so reasoned and more passionate.
And that's the reason why grown, well rounded, secure black folks can't manage to marry and raise their children with combined effort, income, and love?
Yes, I know I might sound like a conservative on this isue. But I really think that we, mature blacks, need to take a strong hard look at why our families have fallen apart. And I'm not concerned about this subject becuase of us, grown folks. I'm concerned because I'm worried about our kids, our babies, our gifts from God.
BTW: Field, you really should have seen Meet the Press. As I was watching it, I was hoping you were. I was all anxious to get your feedback on what Bill was talking about.
Actually, what he was talking about is quite simular to what we're discussing here.
(Sometimes blogging gets on my nerves. But there are other times, like now, that I love blogging.)
Angie
So, what's the real reason why black folks are not loving each other enough to get married?
Can someone help me with this?
Angie
Nuvision
Angie,
If you find out the answer, please tell it to me.
This is so topical, because I was at a gathering over the weekend, and my sister got into it with a guy we knew. He was dogging out professional Black women, and how they think 'they are all that', and no wonder that they are alone, because they deserve it.
My sister was like, ' Look Negro, I bet your son would STILL be married if he had MARRIED A BLACK WOMAN, because a Black woman with some sense, wouldn't be divorcing him. I'm sure that he just loves paying that alimony and child support to that White woman who didn't even wait until the kid turned a year before throwing him out. (His son makes solid six figures). '
But, on a serious tip Angie, I believe there is blame on both parts, and from the Black Woman's part, she turned her back on the teachings of her mothers, grandmothers and aunts, and embraced White Feminism, which NEVER had anything to do with her, or her family and community. Black women have ALWAYS worked. We've AlWAYS had Black women with degrees married to men without them, and somehow, they were able to build a marriage and maintain a family. They provided the example for us, and we threw it away for the man -hating White feminism. We turned the Black man into the enemy, and upon losing the ONLY person that had ever been on his side since we were brought to this country in shackles, the Black man has been drifting.
The minimalization of Fathers has happened in general in this country, but especially in our community. The problem is that, while the White working class woman didn't accept the man-hating mantra of White feminism (look at their marriage rates even now), we did. The White woman's ice was colder, even though we had been shown the way to keep our families in tact through the very worst of times.
I don't want to sound paranoid but if you do research you will see that Evia and her peers have their hands in a lot of the black blogs. They are everywhere. They don't come off as hard as they do on her site but they bash black men whenever they get a chance. For one Gina at "What about Our Daughters" is a big fan of hers. She even calls Evia her "BG"(blogging godmother). And on that site they bash every black man from Obama to Tyler Perry. On any blog when this topic comes up expect Bronze Trinity and the like to show up and declare white men an their savior.
Here comes one of the Internet Ike Turners above. No Field I do not know this woman and I don't read her blog. I stand by what I said, you can call out this blogger if you want but in my opinion, no one blog is a big deal given the millions of blogs out there. Anonymous above I am guessing who you are and once again you are too cowardly to put down your real name. I have never said, you idiot, that white men are our saviours. If you find a single post or comment I ever posted saying that they you are a LIAR. These people just slander any woman who doesn't hate Gina McCauley. You won't find my on Evia's blog or saying that White men are our saviours. That is just slander plain and simple. Evia is not a friend of mine and I don't care one bit about her or her stupid blog!!!!! There are very, very few bloggers who I consider friends of mine. But this person did not invent interracial dating so she doesn't even figure in to any of my ideas about it.
I also noticed no one commented on outlawing interracial marriage. I'm serious, isn't that what you want????
"Internet Ike Turner" see what I'm saying anyone who disagrees is called names. So can no one disagree or is disagreeing with you the same as domestic abuse? Once again that term is something they coined to call out any black man who doesn't agree with them.
I am calling you one of them because you called me out and associated me as one of Evia's defenders and field asked if I was her friend. I can't express my opinion about interacial marriage without these same people drawing links from me to her! For the record I have denounced her blog on my blog so stop asking if I know her! If you want to read it http://bronzetrinity.blogspot.com/2007/10/i-do-not-visit-evias-interracial-blog.html Here!!!! Don't associate me with a blog I don't even read or someone I don't even know!
Fine, I won't call them bloody Ike Turners but they are terrorizing Black female bloggers! Its the anonymous trolls who I am calling Ike Turners because they are too cowardly to show who they really are so that they can be accountable for what they say just like everyone else!
Isn't that Terry McMillian? Why is she in this post?
Black women who date or marry white men need to go over to the "other side." They have no place in a loving black mans life. So go, please go, black women who loves to date or marry white guys, go into the arms of that white guy. Let him deal with your issues. You had issues anyway. It's called, " black identity crisis." something that so many black women, who have a need to for white skin have.
Hey, Field:
This is one topic that always gets Black people going! I'm going to acknowledge again, just for the sake of "keeping it real," that I've dated Black women, white women, Latin American women, Asian women, Middle Eastern women. All of them had something to offer.
The issue is that our dating behavior is always, at least to some degree, a manifestation of our ideation and emotions about our own skin-color, others' skin color, uor past experiences, our environment, and the myriad issues that arise in our society around both of these.
This is what we need to discuss, and we are doing that.
Even though we are speaking about issues that go the the heart of our self-image and our place in our communities and in America, we still need to not take these issues overly personally, because although we discuss what we believe in general, it doesn't mean that we are telling any individual what s/he can or must do.
We also need to all acknowledge the difference between what we may believe is optimal ideally in color matters, and the feelings that erupt within us when we receive color-cues, regardless of our ideals. Let's go easy on each other as we navigate these issues.
EVIA,
A. She was once married to a black man he was her first husband, they got a divorce.
B. She is currently married to a white man he is her second husband
C.Evia, is not light skin she is dark caramel to dark skin
D. She is very jealous of light skin black females blacks (mixed race women), she complained on her blog how black men choose light skin women over black who are dark skin. She calls black men DB (damaged brothers) because they are obsession with white women and light skin black women. She says that white men will appreciate the typical black features, dark skin, and black hair type that black women that black women who are not light skin have. She says black men are color struck and prefer white women, light skin women, and women from other racial groups. She said she would kill her son if he brought home a white women or white girl. When I read this I thought to myself but she is married to a white man, but her son can't bring home a white girl.
F. I feel that Evia, deep down inside is still sexually attracted to black men and prefers a black man but had to settle for her second choice a white man because she felt he was more responsible as a husband. But she would have preferred her first husband who was black to be the ideal man.
All of the things I have written were said by Evia herself on her blog. Unless she was lying.
I hope this gives you some insight into her field Negro.
My only problem with dating outside your race is as follows. There is absoultley positively nothing wrong with finding love outside your race. But when you choose to omit a race of people and would not date someone you have a honest vibe with only becuase of their culture and more dishearting when it is YOUR OWN PEOPLE that you refuse to date their is a mental issue and some deep seeded self hate whether you choose to acknowledge it or not.
"I think this house and field negro thing is really destructive in Willie Lynch fashion. Why create divisions."
Bronze Trinity, why don't you pose the same question to Evia?
BTW, I remember her claim that she was receiving death threats and I don't believe it.
I went to work and all hell broke loose. I knew this was going to get entertaining before it was over with. Evia's blog just has a way of causing folks blood to boil. Like I said from the jump, Evia's blog is the gift that keeps on giving. LOL
But interestingly enough, no one, but Field and Rikyrah has dared to even respond to my questions above. Why is that?
Instead of responding to silly little remarks, let's have a real, meaningful, intelligent discussion about the rift that stands between black folks and marriage, between black folks and two-parent homes, between black folks and combined income.
Really, who gives a freak what Evia has to say? I think it's obvious that this woman is spreading a fractured theology about black men.
Am I asking too much? Or is it just easier to focus on Evia and her damaged blog.
"Black women who date or marry white men need to go over to the "other side." They have no place in a loving black mans life. So go, please go, black women
who loves to date or marry white guys, go into the arms of that white guy. Let him deal with your issues. You had issues anyway. It's called, " black identity
crisis." something that so many black women, who have a need to for white skin have." AAPP
Dang AAPP... Can you be a little less clear how you feel about it.LOL
But all kidding aside.... Do you really feel that strongly about it?
There are some real messy muthafuckas up in here. Information on Evia why don't you come out with a name you normally use? Why not give us a blog so we can judge you? I don't care what that woman is writing, no one has a gun to your heads forcing you to read it. I think the real deal is men want to control women, and you know what, Information on Evia, you are probably the number one Ike Turner on net. And Field, you are harboring this hatred by posting this mess and letting others come here with some messy shit about a woman. WTF? What's next. Giving out her home address? Meeting in front of her house and threatening her with the claim that she needs to learn what a "real" man can do for her? Some of you mutherfucka deserve to get talked about, sorry fuckas.
BTW, I remember her claim that she was receiving death threats and I don't believe it.
Of course you don't believe it. Because if you admit it is a possiblity everyone will see what a fucking bully your shit has led to. Who the fuck are you to say if someone is getting death threats or not? Or you working for the FBI now, the CIA, do you know what is happening with her emails, IM's, etc. No you don't. You just have an ax to grind and being the sorry ass Ike Turner you are, you come here with some mess.
Again, I don't even know the blog, but I can smell a witch hunt from a mile.
Am I asking too much? Or is it just easier to focus on Evia and her damaged blog.
I think you are asking too much. It is like crabs in a barrel. Instead of this disgruntled fool to look at himself, he is going out of his way to attack a woman who no one is forcing him to read. How much do you want to bet, next he will say he is a she in order to throw off the scent. Whatever. I can see a disgruntled ass as quick as I can see a witch hunt brewing.
Kitty,you do realize that there are women that have criticized Evia's blog, so your theory that this is nothing more than men trying to control women is a cop out.
"Of course you don't believe it. Because if you admit it is a possiblity everyone will see what a fucking bully your shit has led to. Who the fuck are you to say if someone is getting death threats or not? Or you working for the FBI now, the CIA, do you know what is happening with her emails, IM's, etc. No you don't. You just have an ax to grind and being the sorry ass Ike Turner you are, you come here with some mess."
And who are YOU to say what someone can or can't believe???
BTW, the same advice you're giving about not reading Evia's blog can also apply to you reading this one.
Here is the deal, you are being messy plain and simple. Messy equals being a coward. FYI, there are women who are tools for men. Women who believe the same shit that men believe, women who will do whatever to curry favor for a man. But it is not women who society hold in greater esteem now is it? IT is men. Race wars are all about men, wars overseas are all about men. Leave that woman alone. You are obviously pissed because there is a sista out there that is not afraid to speak her mind. Get your blog and speak your mind in opposition to her. Or better yet, take the cowardly road and post anonymously every where someone starts a big old pile of shit. Flies to shit brother, flies to shit.
Kitty glendower,
You don't even reveal your face or yourself who Kitty may not even be your real name. So you posting anon also, because you don't reveal yourself just a name only.
Evia is finding out what many black men who date white women have been saying all along. Now Evia is married to a white man she realizes that black men were correct about white women, and this torments evia because she really feels guilty about talking bad about black men and white women relationships, but now she is married to a white man. Thus confiriming what black men say about marrying a white woman. Many of the same things Evia say about black men black men have been the saying same things about black women. All of the good points that Evia say about white men they are the same good points that black men say about whit women. Evia is angry because she realizes that black men were right about why they date white. Evia also does not like being a darker brown skin black woman either, black woman like her are crazy about light skin black men because women like her are darker. It is a skin tone issue and identity crisis. having some half white man (light skin black men)or white man will in the end not make Evia, and the rest of the black women like her feel better about themselves just ask non light skin black men who have tried it out with white women. Clarence Thomas is one of these dark skin self hatred anti light black men. He is similar to Evia meaning it is a skin tone issue Evia and Clarence both married white because for they feel inferior to because of their skin tones.
There are dark skin men and men who are black and they marry white or black, and never have these issues.
You are full of shit. I keep the same name where ever I post, so the fact that I don't reveal my face is of no importance. The fact is, I am quite sure you post on boards and other places starting shit with any woman you cannot control and then find other places to perpetuate your shit. That's the point. You can talk until you are out of breath, your agenda is clear. You cannot stand that a black woman is not allowing you to control her. Your motives are transparent.
What did one of the black women reject you. Like the man who works with my husband, the man who we had dinner with one night, the black man who complained that sisters have the nerve to look at him like his breath stinks when he is up in their face, yet he is married to a white woman, walking around with a wedding ring on, but they are ugly fat hos because they won't talk to him. Yeah right. I see the ax you got to grind. Just pissed because women are no longer allowing men like you to come and go. LMAO! Get a life reject boy.
I did not see this post before I placed my thoughts just now on the previous threat... I agree with you and many others.
I'm more of an advocate for black unity and black on black love. I also know the dangerous compromises that come from the house negroes. Someone stated above "I don't see IR dating as a solution for black women problems", I also agree. However, just like we don't see IR dating as a "solution" for black women problems, then why can't more of us say that in reverse for the black men in IR's? Why can't more of us admit the real issues that cause problems in the black community? Is it because it would call out the black male body as the down fall? Another thing, when black men date out in droves, it's called "to each his own". When even a small percent of black women do it, it's called something far more sinister by both black men and other black women. I still stand by my statements on the first initial thread comment.
Lynn, I would like you to read my previous comment too. I understand some things you said, but there are gray areas. As a black female, you should be mindful what you fight for AND what you fight against. The fighting favor consideration hardly gets reciprocated for black women from black men.
"Why can't more of us admit the real issues that cause problems
in the black community? Is it because it would call out the black male body as the down fall?"
Really? What do you mean by this? Please clarify.
Are you suggesting that the problems that African Americans are facing is because of the faults of the black man? If that's what you are suggesting, please explain your point. Thanks...
Angie
Yes, please do explain.
One of the reasons many black men and women are so uncompassionate, insensitive, unkind, and unsympathetic is because they are raised by many black women like Evia, whom don't instill these beautiful qualities of sympathy, kindness, sensitivity, in them. Therefore, they end up with being two times masculine in personalty. They see all of the masculine black men and get a double portion of that when the black women are suppose to give their feminine qualities of of kindness, sensitivity, empathy, compassion, etc so it it not just the black man's fault only. Hey white women as a collective do an OK job at this.
This is why many white men have these sympathetic qualities, they got them from their white mothers, this true. We need to give credit to the white women for this, because with out them white men would not be as prosperous as they are. When black women date or marry white men all of the good qualities they talk about that white men have it is the white mothers of these men who instilled these good qualities in them. How come many black women like EVIA and others can't do the same among the black race? Is it genetic? Since Evia implied that black men have some kind of sub genetic flaw, well the women of a race are the ones who produce the males and females and therefore, carry all of the genetic DNA of that racial group. So therefore, if black men are inferior it is the result of being born to certain types of black women. Thank GOD, some of us are born to non black women.
This is not an indictment against all black women or black men just those who fit the profile. I feel that one of the reasons that black women don't act too negative with their white husbands or boyfriends is because they know their place. My fellow whites are not going to take all of that crap that black men take, white will put you to park (too the curve and leave the relationship a) fast. You now have too pay to read EVIA blog, it was a scam to get mony out of black women all along. Like many blacks she played on the feels on black women and now got the paying to read her blog, this will become a dating service after long and selling more stuff. Another black taking advantage and making a buck off of unhappy black women. But to each their own if it works for her go for it.
I know you are lurking so come on out!!!
Has anyone seen Harold Ford Jr.'s new fiance: Emily Thelkeld.
I'm just sayin', after those ads in the south showing a white woman talking about partying at the Playboy mansion. I'm just sayin'.
"One of the reasons many black men and women are so uncompassionate, insensitive, unkind, and unsympathetic is because they are raised by many black women
like Evia, whom don't instill these beautiful qualities of sympathy, kindness, sensitivity, in them. Therefore, they end up with being two times masculine
in personalty. They see all of the masculine black men and get a double portion of that when the black women are suppose to give their feminine qualities
of of kindness, sensitivity, empathy, compassion, etc so it it not just the black man's fault only. Hey white women as a collective do an OK job at this." Information on Evia
What?!!! You're kidding, right? Surely you don't mean this. No disrespect but, your comments sound like the babbling language of a troll. What's up?
"This is why many white men have these sympathetic qualities, they got them from their white mothers, this true. We need to give credit to the white women
for this, because with out them white men would not be as prosperous as they are. When black women date or marry white men all of the good qualities they
talk about that white men have it is the white mothers of these men who instilled these good qualities in them. How come many black women like EVIA and
others can't do the same among the black race? Is it genetic? Since Evia implied that black men have some kind of sub genetic flaw, well the women of a
race are the ones who produce the males and females and therefore, carry all of the genetic DNA of that racial group. So therefore, if black men are inferior
it is the result of being born to certain types of black women. Thank GOD, some of us are born to non black women."
What?!!!!!!!!! I find it hard to believe that you really believe that. Again, are you just trying to fan flames on this blog?
Angie
white men are child molesters & spree killers.not to mention sucidial cowards.if a sister wants to be with that,let em go to the white side.im sick of most of these confused whores anyway.quit poppn your booty & loose the ''what can you do for me attitude''& brothers might give you some respect.all woman are stupid,look at the porn industry as long as you let men bust nuts on your face 4 money on camera no one will respect you.billions of dollars are made off woman who dont respect themselves.get some morals & it would all end.WHO WANTS TO BE WITH A FAT ASS,UGLY LOUD ASS WOMAN OF ANY RACE.TO MUCH R&B MUSIC & SPORTS & TENNIS SHOES.THATS WHY WE WILL NEVER GET ANY DAMN TRACTION IN SOCIETY.THEN YOU GOT MORONS LIKE OJ,& VIC,& ANY MORONIC GANGSTA RAPPER TYPES FUCKN IT UP FOR EVERY BROTHER OUT HERE.WE ARE DAMAGED GOODS & THE WHOLE WORLD KNOWS IT.SISTERS NEVER LIKED ME BECUASE I ''TALKED LIKE A WHITE BOY''SORRY FOR USING CORRECT ENGLISH.NOW SHANIQUA WANNA CRACKER.ALL WOMAN ARE FUCKING STUPID.
LOOS LIKE I SHUT THIS SHIT DOWN LOL
Hello,all.
I went to the lady's blog and read some of her posts. I feel that she's downing black men for some very personal reasons,no matter what she says. I also think there is a "white guy is thy savior" type vibe going on.I can understand and agree with her for denouncing the sexism that goes on in our community. She's saying that black women shouldn't be so blindly loyal to black men and look outside our race for happiness and black men are the root of all our troubles.That is utter crap. Why shouldn't be loyal to black men? What is wrong with preferring black men only? Sure there are black men who date other races but there are just as many brothers that want/need/love black women.Not all of them are kicking it with black women until the first available white woman comes along. Not all brothers are unappreciative or hateful towards black women.There seems to be a black man hating thing going on and a very disturbing generalization of ALL black men based on a few bad experiences. I get the feeling that the overall tone of the blog is a hurt woman who has been burned so bad that she's turned away from her own. Maybe I'm wrong but that's what I feel. I wish the sistas/brothers in interracial relationships all the happiness in the world.If you've found happiness,then you are blessed.The message that you should just leave black men and look elsewhere is something can't get with. I've met many men of different races,at work,school,the gym and some were very handsome. But I just love my brothers,I don't want anyone else but them. Nothing and I mean NOTHING excites me more than a dark skinned brother. I can't let my brothers go,hell,I don't want to let them go! I love them to death and they are number one to me always.If she wants to promote interracial relationships,then do it out of genuine attraction and compatability,not out of Whitemansaveme Syndrome(really no different from white women who want a Prnice Charming to swoop in and magically make everything okay) and perceived notions about black men.
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