Wednesday, June 25, 2008

"O' man you are punishing me.


"I have said repeatedly that I think that the death penalty should be applied in very narrow circumstances for the most egregious of crimes," Obama said at a news conference. "I think that the rape of a small child, 6 or 8 years old, is a heinous crime and if a state makes a decision that under narrow, limited, well-defined circumstances the death penalty is at least potentially applicable, that that does not violate our Constitution."



"O" man WTF? File this post under might piss Obamaholics off. But you addicts need to know that your boy is seriously starting to piss me off as well. I mean honest to god, why do I feel like I am being subjected to the Chinese water torture technique every time I listen to the "O" man lately? His FISA vote. Drip. His theocratic tilt. Drip. His going Sista Souljah on Father's Day. Drip. His [non]-universal health care plan.Drip. Paying off the Ice Queen's debt. Drip. And now this latest little gem. "O" man tell me you are not agreeing with Thomas, Scalia, and the other supremes in the minority on this death penalty decision?



Look folks, I know that the "O" man has his own mind, and we aren't going to agree on everything. Lord knows I don't necessarily want him to go along with the liberal orthodoxy. But lately it just seems like he is messing with the shit that I really care about. Things like civil liberties, and keeping the church and our state separated.



I will confess, I am against the death penalty, period. No ifs and buts, no compromise. Maybe it's because I can't get the images of those "strange fruits" hanging from trees back in the day out of my mind (That was a form of sanctioned community killing wasn't it?). But no civilized society should put another one of its citizens to death. I don't give a fuck what he does. It's that simple with me. Throw in the inequities in the justice system, and all the other factors that come along with human nature, and putting someone to death for a crime that we have determined that he committed, just doesn't always pass the smell test.



So now we want to allow states to be able to execute child rapist? --Yeah we all know what a credible witness that little eight year old can be don't we--. Now I must confess that I think if we are going to legally kill someone that would be as good a reason as any to do it. And if an accused can get the death penalty for being involved in a robbery where someone is killed but he didn't actually pull the trigger, why not, you ask, snuff out the son of a bitch that raped the child? That's a fair point, but I wouldn't kill the child rapist or the co-felon in that hypothetical robbery. Because in Fieldville there would be no death penalty. I mean think about it folks. R Kelly could have been looking at the electric chair. No tracks from prison for you Kells.. Let me stop.



I am just disappointed in the "O" man that's all. Capital punishment for a crime other than murder? Slippery slope, slippery slope. I guarantee you that it was just a matter of time before one of these fifty states sanctioned the death penalty for killing a beloved pet..... I know he is a former constitutional law professor and he felt like he had to weigh in on this one. But honestly, he should have just punted. The five justices got it right, the four in the minority got it wrong. What Louisiana was trying to do was to sanction a cruel and unusual punishment for a crime that the punishment did not fit. If that wasn't a violation of the eight amendment they might as well throw it out. Sorry "O" man, if I was in your Con. Law class you would have flunked me.



"We conclude that, in determining whether the death penalty is excessive, there is a distinction between intentional first-degree murder on the one hand and nonhomicide crimes against individual persons, even including child rape, on the other,"


I concur Justice Kennedy. And If he is elected, let's just hope that one very prominent dissenter picks Justices like you.




















104 comments:

szechuanpork said...

The dude was guilty Field. He raped his own step-daughter. GRRRRRR. There just aren't many things lower than a child rapist.

Redstar said...

"I am against the death penalty, period. No ifs and buts, no compromise."

Hear, hear Field. I'm right there with you.

Of course, I'm only now a tepid Obama supporter, but even I'm surprised by this one.

Jody said...

Im with you on this one.... the change I believe in is the change where we as a people understand that the death penalty diminishes us all. We become complicit killers. We cheapen life by supporting it. How the hell do we teach our children that murder is wrong and then turn around and condone murder. And, if strapping someone down and pouring poison into their veins is not pre-meditated murder, then I dont know what is.
There are some people who need to be in prison.... locked up and away from society. That is where this man belongs. I do not want the blood of his murder on my hands. We have got to stop the killing, not add to it.
I am deeply disappointed with Obama on this. I can only hope that his work in Illinois to push for the moratorium on the death penalty(which he was successful in doing) reflects more of what he would support as president than this pandering crap during this election.

NSangoma said...

~
I am deeply disappointed with Obama on this.

Sniff, sniff, snonk!!, snuffle, sniff.

It is not pandering this time, just moving toward the center-right; gotta get those good ole boi votes, the Negroe vote is already in the bank. Hee, hee.
`

field negro said...

"am deeply disappointed with Obama on this. I can only hope that his work in Illinois to push for the moratorium on the death penalty(which he was successful in doing) reflects more of what he would support as president than this pandering crap during this election."

Words to live by jody, words to live by.

"The dude was guilty Field. He raped his own step-daughter. GRRRRRR"

So lock him up for the rest of his life and let the chips fall where they may. Hopefully, when he bends over to pick them up justice will be served, if you get my drift :)Trust me, after a few years with the right prison population he will wish he was dead.

Kriss said...

I'm sorry but if you rape a child you should die. Maybe its wrong of me to think that...but I'm sorry, I have no sympathy for murderers and those that in essence murder the innocence of a child. I'm not mad at the supreme courts decision and I respect those like you field that are probably just bigger people than I am and don't support any death penalty. But I'm not there and probably won't ever be. If someone willingly violates a child and there is no doubt that they did it, then in my view they lose the rights afforded to those in society. That's probably not a good way to look at it but I don't lose sleep over thinking like that. Hell, I think lethal injection would be too good for them. Burn those bastards at the stake...starting with this one:
http://www.kwtx.com/home/headlines/18781294.html

GrannyStandingforTruth said...

I don't think I'll give my opinion on this topic, because my idea of punishment for a child rapist would be worst and extremely cruel.
I'll just put it like this, granny sees red like a bull, when it comes to doing something bad to a child. I don't even like to hear about those types of things, because it takes me too long to get over it. Children can't protect themselves, and if we don't who will?

micheline said...

If he had answered no then he would have been portrayed as another Dukakis.

Mahndisa S. Rigmaiden said...

06 25 08

I just got out of my emergency c-section yesterday. In between pain pills, I decided to visit one of my favorite blogs; yours. FN, you are WRONG on this one. You mentioned that you and your wife thought about adoption or fostering before. I daresay if someone hurt a child that you care for, you would likely want to pull the plug your self.

My little boy is just perfect. He is only two days old and has cleansed my very soul. If anyone dare try to hurt him, their ass is grass. Liberal orthodoxy be damned. This is Obama speaking as a FATHER and parental responsibilities trump political ideology any day. In the end, his statement could unify more of us than not.

micheline said...

The sentence should have read as:

If he had answered that agreed with the decision then he would have been portrayed as another Dukakis.

Elizabeth said...

Preach, field.

I wanna go to fieldville...

-Elizabeth

GrannyStandingforTruth said...

Off topic

I see where the Iraqi President said that Bush and him are closer to a military deal of long term presence in Iraq. Bush is up to some serious trickery that is gonna damage the USA's economic status for good.

Anonymous said...

Ive always felt that putting a man in a cage telling him he will NEVER get out is worse than death. If faced with that, I would probably choose death.
Believe me, the life of a child rapist in Angola, Pelican Bay or Brushy Mountain is PLENTY bad.
The dude will wish he was dead soon enough.

Jackie said...

Slippery slope my caboose. The life of the little child who is raped is ruined. There is no recovering from that so to me, that's as good as a murder. As such, the death penalty as retribution makes perfect sense to me.

Los Angelista said...

I'd love for there to be no death penalty, but as it is now, I'm all for executing proven child molesters. I've known too many folks, both male and female who still suffer as adults from being raped as children. And if you don't want to die, don't touch a child, it's as simple as that.

Kai said...

Field You laid it out there pretty good. Bottom line is that a truly civilized society doesn't kill people for its transgressions. I am of the thinking that most of what people do tends to reflect a deficiency in society more than it is reflective of deviant personal character traits.

I am not with you on the prison 'justice' of being raped in prison you hinted at. That issue absolutely needs to be dealt with in a serious way. I don't think we should ever think that its ok, or funny or acceptable that it happens. If you are opposed to the death penalty you'd have to be opposed to prison rape as a punishment on the same grounds. And you really have to look at it as a serious issue, rape isn't a game ever.

As far as Obama, theres virtually nothing he can do or say to really disappoint a sizeable section of black folks. They will excuse or overlook everything he says or does. I'm gonna have to address that madness at some point.

nyc/caribbean ragazza said...

I am against the death penalty. Most civil societies do not have one. Then again we are not civil. We have one of the worst crime records of any "first" world country.

I don't think the death penalty helps keep crime down, I don't think it's handled fairly (If you are rich you are probably not going to get the chair), and I agree with you this is a slippery slope. That said I do get politics and this was a no win situation for the O man.

Folks don't want to hear legalese when you are talking about a rape of a child and other heinous crimes.

I'm with Liz, if you don't want to get the chair, keep your hands off the kids. We have to stop this cycle. Many people who abuse children where abused themselves. Maybe we should lock up no only the abuser but the person that abused them.

Regarding Hillary's debt that is normal post primary stuff. It's just a question of how much.

Maureen Dowd went off on Karl Rove today for calling Obama arrogant.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/25/opinion/25dowd.html?em&ex=1214625600&en=8368c115b6d559d0&ei=5087%0A

Bob said...

I don't like this kind of nibbling Barack's doing, it reminds me of Bill Clinton. Bill's goal wasn't to take a principled stand on an issue but to prevent the opposition from using it against him.

Curious said...

I think one of the Justices may have said this, but if many of the child rapes are committed by relatives or even parents, wouldn't the child be punished again by knowing or thinking that they were responsible for putting their father or mother to death?

This decision was a right decision and unfortunately another doubt that I have about the "O" man

heartsandflowers said...

Well our 'society' has not yet decided what constitutes the difference between RAPE and "she's fast, she asked for it, I didn't know she was underaged, I thought she consented even though she was drunk or high at the time, she came onto me, her body is the body of a grown woman, her parents said it was ok" and all other variations of excuses men AND women come up with to excuse it. I'd like all guilty rapists to be sent away and never heard from again but that is as likely to happen as being 'lucky' and Black. I'd also like to know if the perpetrator would be executed what about the enablers? I'd be satisfied if the laws accurately reflected circumstances and there were no excuses, no getting out early for good behavior, no....excuses to not punish the criminals.

And as for FISA, I just read a great diary on kos from a woman who knows and gives great perspective.

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/6/22/13830/4343

Prodigy-Maestro said...

People are more comfortable killing(and comitting other crimes) when they know the worst possible consequence is free room and board, free cable, free meals, free gyms, etc.

That's why we need the death penalty. . .

Grata said...

DOn't they have to have DNA evidence from a raped child? They do not need the child to be a credible witness. I guess the level of evidence should matter. If it is proven in testimony and DNA tests, then the rapist should hang.

Don't forget, the O man is speaking as a father of girls. For many men this changes their perception. I know for sure if I had a daughter and she was raped, and I could get away with it, I would kill the fool myself.

So I am definitely with Obama on this one.

Curious said...

Like Columbo said, Oh and just one more thing, if a rapist knows that he will get the death penalty for raping children, why wouldn't he just kill the child so that there are no witnesses? No, the Supreme Court did the right thing by protecting victims from further possible harm.

The Jaded Liberal said...

The question is, what is the purpose of criminal justice? Is it to punish and take revenge, or is it to protect society? The two aims have very different applications.

Capital punishment isn't an effective deterrent because criminals don't care about consequences. Capital punishment is truly a revenge killing that is sanctioned by the state as a "consolation prize" to the families of victims. It has no real societal benefit over life imprisonment. It does have real drawbacks though. People are falsely convicted of murder, and there's no chance for exoneration after a death sentence has been carried out.

I don't think it's the job of the state to provide revenge for victims and their families. I totally understand the desire for revenge, but that's an emotional reaction. Government policy should be based on something more substantial than that.

Please understand, I have no particular moral objection to capital punishment as in "all life is sacred, etc". I actually don't think life is sacred - from everything I see it looks pretty cheap to me. My position is entirely utilitarian. Capital punishment is not good for society.

That being said, if anybody hurt my children I'd simply kill them personally, no state intervention is necessary.

field negro said...

"That being said, if anybody hurt my children I'd simply kill them personally.."

I probably would too if I had any, but I still don't think it's societies job to do that.

congrats mahndisa! I have some names for you :)

Yes bob, I smell "triangulation".

NSangoma said...

~
Read Negroe, read, and if you can't run, read anyway.
`

Christopher said...

I want to think, I want to believe, I am against Capital Punishment, that a sentence for murder of life in prison without the chance of parole is preferable but I have to be honest and say I'm not so sure.

If Jim (my partner of nearly 16 years) were killed at a 7-11 by some punk with a gun robbing the place, or in a home invasion while I was out at the supermarket, I think I would want the miscreant to pay with his life -- providing I don't do it first.

Field, imagine the unimaginable. You come home from work to find Mrs. Field had been raped and murdered, her motionless body laying on the floor in the living room. She had been the victim of a home invasion and robbery.

You see, if you harm my family and take them from me, rest assured you will pay. If the state can't get the job done, I will. You can bet the pig farm on it.

damien said...

Only GOD has the right to take life.

Miranda said...

I don't believe in the death penalty under any circumstances...but (in my best Chris Rock) - I understand - in certain situations, I do understand its applicability.

Nan said...

IMHO, anyone who supports the death penalty has a lot more in common with the criminal than with the victim.

As for Obama, I think he's learned the Dukakis lesson. I am not happy that he's reciting the states' rights mantra or playing to the knuckle-dragging Bubba crowd, but he is a gifted politician who wants to get elected.

Cami B said...

I respect the opinions of both sides of the argument. But I do feel that just because a person identifies himself as a Democrat, it doesn't have to mean he/she agrees with every single idea or view associated with Democrats. Barack kept it real, while he is a Democrat, and probably 99% of his views fit into the neat little Democrat box, he has his own mind. And he is a father of two precious young girls, so I don't doubt that if either of his children were raped he would want the bastard to die. This man woke his 8 year old daughter up out of her sleep, and brutally raped her. Cleaned up the blood on the floor and forced her to blame to annonymous young men for the rape. She had to have surgery after this. This child has been mentally and physically scarred for the rest of her life. I was raped as an adult and I still have some issues I deal with resulting from it. But this was an 8 year old baby. Not even puberty age yet, her tiny body brutalized by this big 6ft+ 300lb man who she called "Daddy". Can you imagine? I see your point,but my personal opinion is that death would be too lenient for this monster. And I consider myself a liberal but I don't necessarily fit into the carbon copy Democrat box.

OBAMA 08!

Kellybelle said...

I agree with you entirely on the death penalty. Too many inequities, too many biases, too many things human to make it right. But say that while you're running for president and you look soft on crime and your opponent slams you with a Willie Horton ad. Remember Dukakis said he was anti-dp even if Kitty was raped and killed and he was deemed a wimp on crime.

I'm trusting Barack is doing what he has to do to close the deal. I think it's sad we live in a country where you can't get elected being who you are.

Christopher said...

Only 15 Democratic Senators were willing to resort to procedural tactics as a last ditch effort to block the FISA legislation from reaching the floor. They are:

Joseph Biden (DE)
Barbara Boxer, (CA)
Sherrod Brown, (OH)
Maria Cantwell, (WA)
Chris Dodd, (CT)
Dick Durbin, (IL)
Russ Feingold, (WI)
Tom Harkin, (IA)
John Kerry, (MA)
Frank Lautenberg, (NJ)
Patrick Leahy, (VT)
Robert Menendez, (NJ)
Bernie Sanders, (VT)
Chuck Schumer, (NY)
Ron Wyden, (OR)

Lookie here at who is missing.

Barack Obama (IL)
Hillary Clinton (NY)

CYA, folks. CYA. And the Fourth Amendment to the Constitution is effectively eviscerated.

I am so angry at Obama I could spit, I tell ya.'

Anonymous said...

I say that if any man arpes a child under the age of 11 and there is plenty of evidence to convict him, announce what he did to every prisoner in general population on his first day there. Then if he makes it ten years through whatever those guys do, kill him immediately because you've just made him the toughest pervert that ever existed! But for real, I would be ready to kill a man who did something like this guy did and I don't blame Obama.

BigJB said...

Your boy is now there boy! He is so intent on seperating himself as the black candidate, that his making himself the house negro candidate. Hell, he almost sounds like a republican candidate.

innercityrose said...

One of the ten commandments is "Thou shall not kill", so because of that I can't get with the death penalty issue. Murdering someone because of their crime will make us know better than the criminal. Castrate and throw them in jail for the rest of their lives and let them rot.

sidebar: please check out following site and add your signature to the petition for Fox News and their behavior.
http://www.colorofchange.org/foxobama/?id=1913-291333

The Christian Progressive Liberal said...

Now, y'all know any opportunity to get rapists off was going to get a vote from Clarence.


Stop Right There.

khia213 said...

As someone who has actually tried a capital case, I can safely say that there is a world of difference between the average person, who thinks they know what happens in a trial, and the person who tries it. People are convinced that at the end of a trial everything is clear and guilt or innocence is easily determined. I wish I could tell you how many cases I've tried and walked away from still not sure who did what to whom. And if I don't know, then the jury damn sure doesn't know better than me. I had the benefit of talking to the defendant for hours and I still may not know.

Taking away the doubt that comes in with all human affairs, there's still the issue of bias in the the judicial system. If people actually knew what prosecutors say when they make the decision to charge someone with a capital crime, they'd run for the hills. I've had a prosecutor say to my face "It's easier for me to get a jury to hate a black defendant and believe he committed a crime." These are the people who make the decision about who gets killed. They can't be trusted. I don't want to give them more opportunity to be wrong and biasd about someone's life.

As for the S.C. decision yesterday, good on them. At the end of a rape, horrible as it may be, the victim is alive. And with that life they are free to move forward, away from what will probably be the most horrific event of their life. Capital punishment, if I were to ever agree that it's necessary, (and I never will) should be reserved for where the victim has died. It is disproportionate to the crime to use it in a rape case.

As for Obama, we are in the period where he will continue to disillusion us. It is the nature of presidential politics. Do I still think he's a better choice than McCain? For sure, but he's going to say some things that disappoint us to win. Wish it wasn't that way.

Afrodite said...

First let's just say that Obama paying off Hillary's debt was a simple exchange...10 million for double that amount in votes and donations from Hillary supporters..Obama's got to play the game and then some if he's planning to win. Secondly, I second everyone who believes that rape is the essentially the murder of the physical, emotional and mental wellbeing of a child. It is the act of ruining a child before they have even grasped an understanding of their world and therefore from that moment on there is a dark tint over their worl. Someone who does that a child and there is NO DOUBT that they did it should be KILLED...and if it was left up to me, I'd stay STONED...
but then again I am pretty close to this topic

esther said...

I dunno, field, I think I'm too emotional to weigh in on this rationally. perhaps the death penalty is unfair. if I had my druthers, homeboy would be castrated slowly and imprecisely with a rusty razor blade followed by them taking a couple of whacks at his thing with a hammer. then they could try to reconstruct his junk like they had to do to the little girl's.

i think that'll work. yeah, 'much more fair.

but i guess that qualifies as cruel and unusual punishment. shame.

This child will have to live with this event emotionally, physically and otherwise, for the rest of her life. I detest people (if that term still applies) that cause this degree of harm to little children.

La ~ msviswan said...

Sorry Field, I don't agree with you on this one. I'm not so hip over the death penalty for various reasons, but something has to be done! These animals can not come back into society, or stay in prison to corrupt other men to do the same. This sick vicious crime seems to be a growing way of life for too long now. They have to be taught a lesson.

We have too many child predators (sexual predators in general) destroying our community. Too many people, especially young black females have been destroyed due to sexual abuse/assault by men in and out the home (then we have the nerve to wonder why some of these black women do the strange things they do). If this strong message is what it will take, then it has to be done. We're sick of this already!

If there was a viciously historical crime where women would lurk in dark alleys, or go into homes of strangers/family to attack men/little boys by cutting off their penis for control, you men would have had us women swinging or jammed up in the chair to fry a long time ago. And don't tell me it aint the same type of crime.

I could never tolerate a rapist. You could always find an excuse or logic for all the other crimes in the book. Even some murders (someone raped your child), stealing (sick hungry children?)... but a rapist? wtf?

Town said...

Barack kept it real, while he is a Democrat, and probably 99% of his views fit into the neat little Democrat box, he has his own mind. And he is a father of two precious young girls, so I don't doubt that if either of his children were raped he would want the bastard to die.
---------------

Didn't Obama write in one of his books that he felt that child rapists should get the death penalty? I read that somewhere. If it's true that he wrote in one of his books that he felt the death penalty was fine for child rapists then he's not "pandering" or "selling out," he's keeping true to what he believes.

He's probably thinking about what if some creep raped his two little girls and that's why he feels the way he does.

hennasplace said...

I do not support the death penalty and I do disgree with Obama. I am not disappointed because it seem that his opinion was based on the fact that he is a father than an attorney. He has little girls and I understand why he would say it.

I think yesterday's decision was correct by the justices. What many people who did not know about this particulars of the case is that originally that the little girl supported her step-father's 911 one call to the police stating she was raped by two boys. The police was convinced that Kennedy the step-father was the prepetrator. The social worker told the mother that child's return would depend on her facing up to the stepfather's role, so the child changed her story and implicated her stepfather.

In addition, the little child stated that the police wanted to change her story. Here is what she say during an interview with the pyschologist. I will tell the same story," she says, her voice rising. "They just want me to change it." The psychologist asks the child, "Who wants you to change it?" The reply: "The policemen. They want me to say my dad did it, and I don't want to change it." Two years later, in a videotape interview the child said that she wrote up in the morning and he (stepfather) was on top of me. He raped me.

Along with the conflicting stories there was the matter of DNA and physically evidence to link the stepfather to crime. Rape is a difficult crime to prove in case where an adult is the victime, and we think that is different when a child is the victim. I do not know if the child is going to be a relible witness particular as time goes by. If the child was rape at the age of 8 just like in the case the Supreme Court rule and the case takes a few years to come to trial, memories will disminish. I do not I can not remember what I had lunch on Thursday June 13, 2007and I am not under distressed or being questioned about it. In addition, we also know that these rape child cases tend to involve a family member or someone the child knows, and do you really expect a child to testify knowing that what they could mean that the person will be punished by death. Do we really want to add to the child's tramua?

Here is the problem, we tend to have knee-jerk reactions and there is not question that a person who rapes a child is vicious and that is putting it mildly, but lawmakers can set mandates on crimes of this nature that can put the person away for more than 25 years without the death penalty particularly when death did not result in the crime.

Zimbel said...

Frankly, I'm more upset at his FISA position than his death penalty one.

My present position on the death penalty is that it should only be used against presently incarcerated people who murder while they are incarcerated. I am waffling on if that is large enough of a group to keep up any support of the death penalty.

To put it another way, I might want to kill the person for some heinous crime, but I don't think that doing so is good public policy.

AgentX said...

This one's a tricky one to cover.
I have heard that pedophiles are essentially uncurable and many are repeat offenders. Not all, mind you, but many.

Then again, given the state of the Justice Dept, and the entire justice system, and the lack of competence in the legal profession (you're a lawyer aren't you Field? I'm sure you're about as useful as wet toilet paper inside and outside the court) should we even be having the death penalty? Obama had to spend considerable time fixing the death penalty in IL before becoming a Senator. So I'm sure he's aware of the possibility of someone getting railroaded because of lax protections.

west coast story said...

WEll, that's two strikes for me. I'm staunchly against the death penalty, logically, although I'd like to personally take out a few really horrible offenders but that's emotion talking.

The other strike is the part of the FISA bill that protects communications companies from being sued if they share personal info with the government. I feel much more strongly about this and I don't understand his position on this one bit.

Professor Tracey said...

And I think folks need to stick to the merits of discussing whether you give the death penalty in cases like this or not.

I am highly troubled at the discounting of the rape victim going on here. Particularly a BLACK child victim. Black women already are NEVER believed in rape cases (R, Kelly, ring a bell) Now, we are going to throw black female children under the bus too?

@Hennasplace

If you are going to report on case evidence, put it all out there.

It was presented as evidence at this guy's trial that he called a cleaning service to clean up blood in the house, BEFORE calling 911 to get help for his stepdaughter. What innocent man does that?

If she was raped outside the house, why was there blood inside the house and on the girl's bed? This girl walked a distance after being attacked so badly that she had internal bleeding? She was bleeding heavily, wouldn't there have been a blood trail to the original location if she had been raped outside of the house?

And this man's adult goddaughter also testified against him for assaulting her at the same age.

Despite the commonly held belief, there is not always DNA evidence in rape cases.

And what 8 year old wants to accuse her so-called step father of rape? That means her mother has to believe her. How many cases of sexually abuse children with the mother sitting right there looking? Tons.

And do you think it really lessens a child's trauma to know that their rapist maybe freed from prison one day?

Woozie said...

No, Field, he's leaving it up to the states so that he doesn't have to bother taking a stand on a wedge issue. It's something Republicans have mastered, by the way.

Kat said...

I'm against the death penalty. We shouldn't lower ourselves as a society for what a scumbag did.

MacDaddy said...

nsangoma said: "It is not pandering this time, just moving toward the center-right; gotta get those good ole boi votes, the Negroe vote is already in the bank. Hee, hee."

field: Thanks for saying what a lot of people are thinking. I mean, we're barely into the general, and this guy is backtracking to the right of center like crazy. It was bad enough that he appeared before AIPAC, the Israeli lobby organization, and cowtowed to them like a southern belle at a pre-civil war ball. Now, he's even going against some of his democratic party leaders by going along with a FISA bill that will give the government the right to spy on any communications that goes out to a foreign country or comes in from a foreign country without a warrant, even a call from momma or text message from your little brother. It's pathetic. The only good thing that's going to come out of this centrist bullshit is that people are going to see just what two fine senators we have in Christopher Dodd and Feingold, who have indicated that they will filibuster the FISA bill.
nsangoma: I know I've criticized your comments at times, but you are spot on. Thank you.

`

A.F. said...

Well, Field, you certainly haven't pissed off this Obamaholic. Obama has. I am against the death penalty under any circumstances, also, and Obama is aware of research indicating that it doesn't deter crime or accomplish anything remotely positive. Maybe he believes what he's saying, or maybe he's trying to get more of the republican vote. Either way, though, I'm reminded of the quotation (by Vonnegut, I think), "We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be."

Anonymous said...

Seems like the people coming down in favor of the death penalty either
1) are parents of small children or
2) have been raped or had someone close to them has been raped.

Field, you can count me in both those categories, and I am definitely in agreement with Obama on this one.

You could make the counter-argument that since we're so emotionally biased, it's those who haven't been touched by this that should make the decision against death for child rapists, but I prefer to see it as "we've been there, we understand the pain" and we find death to be appropriate in this case.

And as for FISA, I agree, he's definitely triangulating. The big thing for me was the backtracking on campaign financing.

Then again... do we want this dude to be perfect, or to win? Because I dare say in our system, you unfortunately have to choose.

Sincerely,
Jimbo

hennasplace said...

Professor Tracy:

The case is still muddle because it comes down to the story since the evidence. I am not saying that the guy's story was pausible. However, the problem is that when the police and social worker became involved talking to an 8 year-old to get to change her story. You have a group of adults from the stepfather to the police to the social worker talking to this little telling her what and what not to say, and you do over a period of year, you are going to have a difficult time proving the stepfather did anything, and Tracey he probably did it. However, you need to prove it. It's not what I or you think, it's matter of proving that he committed the crime.

You asked a question about the trauma being lessen if the rapist should be free. There are ways to rapist in prison until they are too old to harm anyone. I do not a problem with a 25 year to life sentence. However, rapists do not stay in prison when they an adult is involved. People do not know how traumatic you have to face the defendent. What if the child had to face the defendent who is her father? Do you know how complicated the emotions will be that although he have committed this act against his own child, but he or she will still have love for the man? He or she will bear the responsibility of sending him to prison and does add to the trauma. Of course, my friend disagrees with the theory because it is something white thought, but she is wrong and speaking from an adult's perspective and not from the child's.

There is not easy solution for this problem because you want to protect the child.

hennasplace said...

Professor Tracy:

The case is still muddle because it comes down to the story since the evidence. I am not saying that the guy's story was pausible. However, the problem is that when the police and social worker became involved talking to an 8 year-old to get to change her story. You have a group of adults from the stepfather to the police to the social worker talking to this little telling her what and what not to say, and you do over a period of year, you are going to have a difficult time proving the stepfather did anything, and Tracey he probably did it. However, you need to prove it. It's not what I or you think, it's matter of proving that he committed the crime.

You asked a question about the trauma being lessen if the rapist should be free. There are ways to rapist in prison until they are too old to harm anyone. I do not a problem with a 25 year to life sentence. However, rapists do not stay in prison when they an adult is involved. People do not know how traumatic you have to face the defendent. What if the child had to face the defendent who is her father? Do you know how complicated the emotions will be that although he have committed this act against his own child, but he or she will still have love for the man? He or she will bear the responsibility of sending him to prison and does add to the trauma. Of course, my friend disagrees with the theory because it is something white thought, but she is wrong and speaking from an adult's perspective and not from the child's.

There is not easy solution for this problem because you want to protect the child.

WNG said...

As a survivor of childhood sexual abuse I have to say that I am still against the death penalty. This is not something I believe you can take on a case by case basis. Killing people is wrong or killing people is ok. If it is wrong then it's wrong for everyone, including the State. Of course my parents wanted to kill my abuser, but that is just one reason we have a jury trail system.
The guilt and shame that I felt was horrenous enough - seeing myself as responsible for his death would not have helped me in any way.
I don't think there has ever been a study done that shows that capital punishment is an actual deterrent. Even if there was one - killing is still wrong. How do you get around that one?
It might make us all feel better to kill the people who hurt our children, but it will not help us protect our children and it will not help our children heal.
The death penalty is the very definition of cruel and unusual punishment. It is the state murdering its own citizens with arbitrary and ever changing rules, waiting periods and methods of execution. It costs us more money for no more safety and it imperils the righteousness of the 'more perfect union' we are tasked with creating.

Whitney B. said...

Field,

I agree with you on all your drips, I surely do! Having been an O Man supporter from day one, I am getting a little miffed (sniffed) at some of the flipping and flopping going on.

I am totally opposed to the death penalty, but this wasn't always so. When I lived in Texas, the Shrubbabubba was King. During his reign, it seemed as if we had an execution every week. We later came to find out that some of those folks, who were mostly black, were innocent and there was no Jesus around to resurect the dead! Now, that is just plain wrong and bullshit supreme!!!

I think that what khia213 had to say just about sums that up.

That being said, if anyone were to rape my husband's daughter or his sweet grandson, I would go out and by me the biggest baddest shotgun I could find. A few years in prison would be worth it. If I spent that time constructively and studied law, can a killer be a lawyer?

Christopher,
Thanks for the FISA info. I am dripping mad on that one!

Grannystandingfortruth,
Thanks for the off topic on what snarky little Bubba is up to. Whoa! He's gotta go. Promise me that when you get to heaven you will ask God if you can take over St. Peter's post!

Now, my own off topic:
WHY ARE WE NOT SCREAMING UP AND DOWN TO RE-INSTITUTE THE DRAFT? It is poor folks like us middle class that are seeing our families die over there (I've lost 2). Now, we know that some, like Dubba Bubba, will be able to sneak out for various nefarious reasons, but this is the only way that we will be able to end this mess in Iraq.

Blacklett,
How's those mittens coming?:)

Just trying to end this on a less ranty note.

mellaneous said...

I feel you on this brother Field. Even if you wanted to support the death penalty people have to remember that in our classist and racist society it would be applied unequally to child rapists as it is currently applied unequally to poor folks and people of color.

Folks in the US sure do like to kid themselves about what justice really means in this country even as we black folks stare it in the face everyday.

Field you have figured it out. Obama is what folks who people don't want to listen have said all along, and that is he a representative of bourgeious capitalism running a centrist campaign within that framework.

For those like MacDaddy, Kai, brother Komrad and brother Field and granny and others,who remember what a real liberal program looks like, we all know that, this is not a classical liberal platform that brother Obama is campaigning on.

I sure hope all the folks who simply believe in Obama are right and that once in office he will suddenly suggest a progressive program that rights the wrongs of this country and bring the troops home within 3 months and cut out all the adventurism and implement universal health care and cut back on the prison population, and federalize public education so that all children can have access to a quality public education and provide more livable wage paying jobs for all those terrible black fathers (and everyone else for that matter) he likes to pick on, rebuild the public infrastucture, force the rich to pay a larger share of taxes, close their tax shelters, reign in the Wall Street gang, restore habeus corpus and cut out the renditions and denial of due process in the name of fighting terrrorism, and....

Oh did folks check Senator Dodd the other day. Have folks looked at this surveillance bill and what it implies. Brothers and sisters these are scary times.

MacDaddy said...

wng: Best to you for surviving the trauma and living to share it with us. And you and kellybelle: the state putting people to death is not just morally wrong, it hasn't proven to a deterrent against crime. Obama knows this. He's a constitutional scholar and law professor who supported a legal program that got black men off deathrow (being a lawyer, field may know of the program); and, as a legislator, he's argued against the death penalty, one of many who influenced the governor to call a moratorium on the death penalty in the state. So, he's doing this purely for politics.
Mellaneous: You're right. This doesn't come close to the type of liberal politics of, say, a Paul Wellstone, the late senator from Minnesota. It's just pandering to get into the White House.

Nobody is asking Obama to perform miracles. Just do the right thing on key issues like FISA and the death penalty. Rather than pandering, he would be shoring up his democratic base.

rikyrah said...

1. I totally disagree with him on FISA. Period.

2. I disagree with him on the death penalty for child rapists.

See. I'd put the pedophile in jail.

Tell the prisoners what he did.

Make sure the guards took a long break.

And let the prisoners do what they do to pedophiles.

Clean him up, put him in isolation so that he can heal.

And, as soon as he's healthy.

Repeat it all over again.

Until the time the guards come back, and he's not breathing.


3. Have no problem with him going after the evangelicals. He's going after the moderate to liberal evangelicals. I just don't have any qualms with this politically, because it's been assinine to let the GOP define what ' religion' is for this country for a generation. Bump Dat.

4. You just threw the health care in there for extra measure, FN. Stop it. He didn't hide that from you. That was a cheap shot.

5. The debt is what it is. He CAN'T pay it off. He CAN ask his 'big pooba' supporters to help, because 'the little people' have already told him hell no. That was expected.

6. Sorry Field. I agree with the decision by SCOTUS on the Second Amendment. Gun Control laws only help the criminals. Law abiding citizens who live in cities are stuck-like-chuck under these laws.

7. We will agree to disagree about Father's Day. Nothing he said wasn't something he hadn't said plenty of times before. We'll agree to disagree on this one.

All in all, outside of FISA, I'm still cool with The 'O' Man.

grown said...

What is the point of putting someone in jail to have them sodomized repeatedly?

That's not only extremly hypocritical, it's more sadistic and inhumane than the death penalty could ever be.

If you oppose the death penalty, do it on the basis of "justice for all" or some shit...not because you want to see some cruel punishment played out.

awb said...

I agree with the Field. Killing someone is something you can't take back. The premise that someone is ruined forever by child rape is false in my opinion because I am sure there are many promininent sucessful people who have managed to overcome that sort of terrible history. Correct me if I am wrong but wasn't Oprah sexually assaulted as a child? That football player for the jets?

And it goes both ways. A man stuck in prison for something he didn't do can be vindicated pre mortem if there is no death penalty. Again, You can't take it back. If the many death row DNA exonerations don't illustrate the fallibility of our justice sentence than nothing will. While we have one of the better legal systems around it is not perfect. I don't like a system like that having the power of life and death.

RedLipstick said...

Oh FN I'm definitely NOT with you here.

State sanctioned death is appropriate for child molesters. It is a most horrible and egregious offense and most people who commit this type of crime will almost always do it again.

You really think it's more humane to have molesters raped by other prisoners over the course of how many ever years than to simply put them to death?

Is that not a vindictive and vengeful stance rather than simply a punitive one?

Never mind the disease spreading and the costs of housing/feeding these jokers for 30 to 40 years.

I'm annoyed by the time it takes to put a person to death--a convicted criminal should not be on death row for 15 years.

Executions should be carried out expeditiously!

And if you harm a small child in this way--the faster the better!

Lola Gets said...

Ok, perhaps the Supreme Court was right on this issue, constitutionally that is (if thats a word, lol). BUT, on overthrowing DCs ban on handguns, they were WRONG, WRONG, WRONG! WHY THE FUCK do we need HANDGUNS in OUR OWN HOMEs when we can have SHOTGUNS?? THOSE were LEGAL! But nooOOOOoooo, thats not good enough for them!

It really burns my butt that folks who dont even LIVE in DC, tell us what we can and can not do in our own city.

Field, why are they lining up for food in Milwaukee? In my fit of rage, I must have missed that on the news.

L

Ms.Martin said...

I don't think you'd feel this way if a grown man tore into your 8 year old daughter's body in a frenzied sexual ramapage to relieve himself of an orgasm.

A small child forced into sexual intercourse with a grown man whose penis was too big for her vagina, so much so that it ripped her insides apart and she had to have surgery.

I wonder what the poor baby was thinking while he did this too her and I wonder what happens to the little boys who are sodomized and don't die.

GET THE PICTURE.

Studies show that phedophiles are incurable; they will rape again.

I say kill the mofos and spare the poor innocent children a fate we know will come.

I am willing to do whatever it takes to spare the innocents.

Ms.Martin said...

And another thing, this 8 year old didn't need to testify, her body told the whole story - where is the fking outrage for her?

kathy said...

I am against the death penalty. However, since there is one, I believe raping a 6 year old or 8 year old baby is the same as a slow death for the child. It can mean the loss or severe damage of reproductive organs as well as severe emotional trauma that may well be life-long.

If I remember correctly, the felony charges for selling drugs is higher than rape in NYS. Plus, due to plea bargaining, some rapist are not even convicted of the actual crime of rape, don't get treatment,and aren't tracked.

Obama did surprise me, but I understand his point of view.

Hathor said...

What happens when those cases are not so clear? It has been know that if a child is not properly interviewed that there understanding of what happened can be changed. And do we assume that a child never lies, especially if threatened by the abuser. What happens when one parent uses rape of their child as a means of revenge against the spouse?

Texas itself is know for prosecutorial misconduct in too many death penalty cases.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]I will confess, I am against the death penalty, period. No ifs and buts, no compromise.[/quote]

Field-Negro - You and the "Little Professor" Marc Lamont Hill prove via so many of your diatribes that you simply have it too good and thus are increasingly irreverent.

Where as Prof Hill is able to announce his support for Killa Mu and the "Move 9" in the backdrop of 157 dead people on the streets of Philly which he has yet to take to the streets upon.....YOU proclaim your opposition to the "Death Penalty".

Why aren't you more specific? You are opposed to STATE execution even after DUE PROCESS has been consummated upon the KILLER.

What about the 157 people who have had their DEATH PENALTY RENDERED on the streets of Philly? As you sit back and drink your espresso and make your blog entries there is NOTHING that you can do to stop the "Kneegrows that KILL" from rendering their vengeance upon their adversaries.

This points back to what I have always said about Liberalism and the "Black Quasi-Socialist Progressive-Fundamentalist Racism Chaser" it is incumbent upon your rationale to have a person who GIVES A DAMN WHAT YOU THINK before they will attempt to live up to your standards. In this case your "anti-death penalty stance".

You are an irrelevant fraud with respect to what is going on in the streets.

Philly - JUST ONE, Democratically controlled city has thus far hosted the DEATHS of more people this year than what the GOVERNMENT has rendered as a sentence in the entire country.

At what point, Field-Negro do you drop your slavish milieu and instead choose PRAGMATISM?

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]Now, y'all know any opportunity to get rapists off was going to get a vote from Clarence.[/quote]

The character assassin strikes again.

DAMN (sorry I mean "darn it". I am a church going man) I just gave her another piece of evidence in her charge that I am "stalking her".

Field-Negro - did you know that I am STALKING YOU because I am responding to the foolishness that you post?

Constructive Feedback said...

Mahndisa S. Rigmaiden:

I am happy for you and the new life that you have brought into this world.

Even though we have had only a few interactions via various blogs - I can tell that you are a conscious woman and will instill the proper values into your son.

May he be a credit to this world and to you.

Constructive Feedback said...

Field-Negro:

I would be dishonest if I did not take a step back and give you credit for assembling the best collection of LEFTIST THOUGHT that is present on the Internet today. You should be proud of your posters. (I am serious).

I get to scan the responses on your blog and have my own beliefs fortified.

I have to thank you for creating the "Cliff Notes" on Liberalism and "Black Quasi-Socialist Progressive Fundamentalist Racism Chasing" there is on the Internet.

Here are my random thoughts on posts that have jumped out at me:

His going Sista Souljah on Father's Day
(He spoke the truth and you attack him)

Lord knows I don't necessarily want him to go along with the liberal orthodoxy
(If ONLY you focused on if this orthodoxy is actually WORKING rather than just being POPULAR this would be great)

Things like civil liberties, and keeping the church and our state separated.(You need to holla at the government of Washington DC which is violating the 4th amendment rights in the name of safety.

I can't get the images of those "strange fruits" hanging from trees back in the day out of my mind (That was a form of sanctioned community killing wasn't it?).But no civilized society should put another one of its citizens to death. Throw in the inequities in the justice system, and all the other factors that come along with human nature, and putting someone to death for a crime that we have determined that he committed, just doesn't always pass the smell test
(Field-Negro - do you NOT believe that the THUG NEGRO KILLERS in Philly are part of the SOCIETY?)


I believe in is the change where we as a people understand that the death penalty diminishes us all.
How the hell do we teach our children that murder is wrong and then turn around and condone murder.
(TELL THE KILLERS THIS and we'd be cool. Do you remember the saying "Don't start none, won't be none?)

Kriss: I'm sorry but if you rape a child you should die. Maybe its wrong of me to think that...but I'm sorry, I have no sympathy for murderers and those that in essence murder the innocence of a child.
BLESS YOU AND THANK YOU!! An isle of reason in a sea of IN-DAMNED-SANITY from the left

Kai: Bottom line is that a truly civilized society doesn't kill people for its transgressions.
(What TRANSGRESSIONS were present in the 52% run up of Black male homicides per the FBI report?)

The Jaded Liberal: Capital punishment isn't an effective deterrent because criminals don't care about consequences.
(This is plain DUMB. Dismount your LEFTIST high horse and render a plan to tell the PEOPLE DOING THE KILLING THIS!!!)

Christoper: If Jim (my partner of nearly 16 years) were killed at a 7-11 by some punk with a gun robbing the place, or in a home invasion while I was out at the supermarket, I think I would want the miscreant to pay with his life -- providing I don't do it first.
(Subjective and Personalized Justice INDEED!!!)

Damien:Only GOD has the right to take life.
(Tell that to the THUGS in Philly, elsewhere.)

KelleBelle - I think it's sad we live in a country where you can't get elected being who you are.
(Still there is NOTHING that he can do now for you NOT TO vote for him. This is sad)

Whitney B. said...

Constructive Feedback,

Now, I think your thinking is bad. I have no idea if you are black or white, but I guess that you are a proud gay man. As far as I am concerned, that is good, even great given what society these days is dishing out. We are all whatever we are intended to be. There is no shame if our hearts are right. Period!!!

However, the death penalty is wrong. One reason it is wrong is because nine times out of ten, it seems to be aimed at a person of color or one who cannot afford to defend himself/herself with a private (highly paid) attorney. That is what I take issue with.

And, the fact that if justice prevailed, we would take it upon ourselves to do something about it. As folks. Not lynching, like the old (bad old) days, but as taking justice in our own hands (were it to be a member of our own family, which actually does happen). Just as what you said about your Jim.

So, therefore, let's look at the alternative. This nasty, puking pedophile is going to end up in jail and the inmates are going to find out about this filthy prick. So, like that guy in Milwaukee, WS that ate his victims, he will probably be roasted by the inmates. Actually, that is a better demise than being injected, no?

evole said...

I see Obama is now moving to the right. Well he can keep right on going. If he can't support the 4th amendment, I certainly can't vote for him. And Blacks are mistaken if they think Obama will represent their interest once he is in the white house.

Whitney B. said...

Off topic:

Mr. Field,

I had a question I forgot to ask: do you like goats blood and brain soup? From what I understood it was considered a national dish for Jamaica. Where, from that beautiful land, do you originate? I have been to a number of places, and I so loved my time in Kingston, but I think I liked Ocho the best, especially the back roads and folks. Very non-English and lots of fun.

Whit

Professor Zero said...

Think McKinney.

rikyrah said...

Mahndisa,

Congratulations!!!

Many blessings to you and the new life. I know you will cherish it.

szechuanpork said...

Lola, "Field, why are they lining up for food in Milwaukee? In my fit of rage, I must have missed that on the news."

They lined up based on a rumor of free food. No one got any food, just a waste of time.

I heard a reggae song on the radio by Coco T today called Barack Obama. Seemed lightweight to me on the first hearing.

Christopher said...

Field,

I thought you banned this asswipe, (Un)constructive Feedsack? That's a regular shame that it has returned to post its idiocy.

Whitney B. said...

Chistopher,

I love everything that you post and keep on keeping on. I think that it is good that the wingnuts, left and right, have a voice here. I really truly believe that Mr. Field is THE voice of the left wingnuts, but with his education, he can be a leader and example to all of us. I am thankful for what you posted today about FISA and I think you are really one of the great intellects on this site, along with Grannystandingfortruth.

We have to ride out the current storm and see where it leads. Notice, too, that Mr. Field has not responded to Constructive Feedback, nor to any of us. That, in itself, means that he is thinking hard about whatever mojo is going on between comments to his blog.

With a lot of respect to you, Mr. Christopher,

Whitney Brown

field negro said...

"I thought you banned this asswipe, (Un)constructive Feedsack? That's a regular shame that it has returned to post its idiocy."

christopher, why would I do that? Havng him post his vacuous illogical and anserine comments only helps to prove my theory about these new money conservative Negroes. So out of touch and clueless about what is really happening in the world. Talking about the deaths in Philly from the basement of his suburban rancher... and being glad to be so far far away from these mean streets. Must be nice.

This clown accuses me of not having my feet to the fire here in the city, when nothing could be farther from the truth. Trust me [un]constructive....I have done more than my share of giving back with time and money to the causes that really matter. But you wouldn't know anything about that since you are too busy trying to be something that you are not. Find yourself my brother,you will sleep better at night.

" I would be dishonest if I did not take a step back and give you credit for assembling the best collection of LEFTIST THOUGHT that is present on the Internet today."

I thank you, and I am sure the folks who hang out here would like to thank you as well. "Leftist" huh? I resemble that remark ;)

whitney B, that sounds like "manish water" that stuff will put the wind at your back if you get my drift :)

I am from Mandeville (shhhh). Don't you say a word about my little hometown, we like to keep it a secret. Ochie is cool too. But like Kingston, it's a little too hot for the kid.

Whitney B. said...

Field,

I fell of my chair laughing! Trip me out why doncha! However, the secret will be well kept. Yikes!

As for Kingston, you just have to run with them that know where to run and nothing on the Island is too hot, as the breezes always blow the right way when you are there, mon. 'specially when you're blowing cooool!

Now, I ask (or should I bug you with my husband's dialect, "ax") that you please bring up, now or in the future, the issue of THE DRAFT. You have it on your side bar, but we really need to be talking about it with regards to the fact of all of our family members (being that we are all related in DNA) are dying in this police action where we're not supposed to be.

I mean, the only way that this BS will end is if somebody, hopefully Mr. Drips, will start the process to re-instate that ugly little thing which will bring about the end of this very wrong place in the world where we are now.

I'm pretty mad about this, but that may be because I have lost 2 family members to this crap. Except for the fact that I was against it before I was against it!!!

Can we get a petition going for Grannystandingfortruth to get St. Peter retired when she makes it to the Spirit in the Sky?

Thank you, Mr. Field. I am grateful for this outpost and the many wonderful folks (and the opposing views) that join you in your blog.

Respectfully,
Whitney Brown

Christopher said...

Field,

Yeah, you're correct.

Having it post is akin to reading a post by Charles Manson is they gave him access to a keyboard and the internet.

Michelle said...

So now we want to allow states to be able to execute child rapist? --Yeah we all know what a credible witness that little eight year old can be don't we--

That right there, assuming it's sarcasm and casting doubt on the word of a child just because s/he is a child -- is pretty horrific.

Children are treated like crap in this society. They have no power, they are basically positioned as objects to be assessed and/or used by adults. Whether it's use by "think of the children" or disrespect of their word.

Objects. Less than. Not fully human. Defined that way through the institutionalized power of those who are not children.

And: I have seen pictures of Senator Obama with his daughters. Look at them. Look at how much he loves those girls. It shines -- unmistakable.

And also: I don't know what I feel about the death penalty as an abstract. I personally for myself don't think death is the worst punishment versus being in jail for life -- but that's just me, death doesn't worry me as applied to my own self, so I don't know how to understand it. Cruel/painful death is another story and I do object to the cruelty of how death sentences are carried out.

I also know the "justice" system in this country is racist, classist and IMO not set up to get at actual truth and actual justice. In my standards (which are not widely shared I know) you cannot get to the truth of what actually happened and what would be best to do by using a a system requiring conflict and exaggeration on both sides.

So I don't know where I am at on the larger issue. But this casual disresepct of a child, especially someone who might have had horrific experiences -- it turned my stomach to read (assuming it was a sarcastic comment, sorry if I misread).

Constructive Feedback said...

How To Talk To An Obama Cultist
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcjNY8mGhxw&feature=related

All Hail Obama Ouija, All Hail Obama Ouija, All Hail Obama Ouija, All Hail Obama Ouija, All Hail Obama Ouija, All Hail Obama Ouija, All Hail Obama Ouija, All Hail Obama Ouija,

Constructive Feedback said...

CHRISTOPHER:

Did you see what Whitney B - ASSumed about me?

[quote]Now, I think your thinking is bad. [/quote]

Whitney B - Is "my thinking bad" or is my THINKING COUNTER TO YOUR VIEWS? I think that THIS is my greater offense in your mind. But I understand how you THINK.


[quote]I have no idea if you are black or white, but I guess that you are a proud gay man. As far as I am concerned, that is good, even great given what society these days is dishing out. We are all whatever we are intended to be. There is no shame if our hearts are right. Period!![/quote]

Whitney B - I am a PROUD BLACK MAN. I am straight. I am married to a Black woman. I am a Resident FATHER.

There is no SHAME in my have a set of beliefs that are TRIED AND TRUE as the bedrock for building a STRONG BLACK COMMUNITY. Indeed "our hearts must be right" but OUR HEADS ALSO.

[quote]
However, the death penalty is wrong. One reason it is wrong is because nine times out of ten, it seems to be aimed at a person of color or one who cannot afford to defend himself/herself with a private (highly paid) attorney. That is what I take issue with.[/quote]

This is what frustrates me the most in debating with LEFTISTS. You pull stuff out of your backside with no rational evidence to justify this claim.

Here is a good series on the Death Penalty by the LEFT LEANING Atlanta Journal Constitution: http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/metro/stories/deathpenalty

The conclusion of the series INADVERTENTLY points out something that they were not intending to point out:

The REASON WHY it appears that a person is more likely to receive the death penalty for killing a WHITE PERSON is because the MAJORITY WHITE COUNTIES in Georgia are more inclined to SEEK THE DEATH PENALTY. The counties in Georgia with more BLACK PEOPLE who are more inclined to be LEFTISTS....the fewer death penalty sentences are handed down.

In summary - YOU ARE PRODUCING WHAT YOUR IDEOLOGY CALLS FOR!!! And yet you are STILL BITCHING!!!

In this specific story - each county has its own district attorney and the policies of the PEOPLE are expressed by this office. Since more White people kill other White people and since there is a good chance that they live in these WHITE COUNTIES - they will receive the death penalty. If a Black person kills a White person in one of these White counties - he is likely to receive the death penalty.

The news from last Thursday of an Indian man having had a Black woman killed because he did not want his son married to a Black woman....what was his sentence from a majority Black jury in Fulton County? LIFE IN PRISON.

You should be overjoyed that he was not rendered the death penalty. Instead having an EXPANSIVE IDEOLOGY you don't look at the crimes that are committed in the areas that you cover - you look at the death penalty in other counties and you disagree with them.

It was not this Indian man's HIGH PRICED ATTORNEY who got him the death penalty. It was a group in the jury pool WHO THOUGHT AS YOU THINK regarding the death penalty.

IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE DEATH PENALTY.....DON'T KILL ANYONE.

IF YOU POINT TO THE PEOPLE THAT THE 'INNOCENCE PROJECT' HAVE GOTTEN SPRUNG - I'LL POINT TO THE HOMICIDE STATISTICS AND MAKE NOTE "SOMEBODY HAD TO KILL THESE PEOPLE". Clearly they don't GIVE A DAMN about your opposition to the death penalty - they just rendered it.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]do you like goats blood and brain soup? From what I understood it was considered a national dish for Jamaica[/quote]

It is called "Goat Head Soup" or "Manish Water". Remember that FEMALE who I told you about in the other post that I am married to? She could tell you a thing or two about it.

The "goats blood" is not an essential part of the recipe. It is nothing more than a goat head, often purchased from the local farmer's market, cracked into pieces and then boiled into a soup with vegetables, yams and other seasoning. It is not the "brain" that is the essential element (some people remove it while others leave it in) it is the meat all around the head itself that is of interest.

Not that I would know or anything - being that I socialize with more Jamaicans than Americans per my heterosexual marriage.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]I thought you banned this asswipe, (Un)constructive Feedsack? That's a regular shame that it has returned to post its idiocy.[/quote]

Christopher - you don't realize how difficult it is for me to refrain from attack on you and just stick to the facts.

Why don't you cut and paste my "idiocy" and tear it apart line by line?

It is clear to me that your line of thinking can only survive in a homogeneous set of minds that circle the porch light at night.

Constructive Feedback said...

[quote]I really truly believe that Mr. Field is THE voice of the left wingnuts, but with his education, he can be a leader and example to all of us. I am thankful for what you posted today about FISA and I think you are really one of the great intellects on this site, along with Grannystandingfortruth.[/quote]

ORRRRRR Whitney - this could be the key difference between OBAMA and YOU.

Obama as a sitting senator must some times depart with his leftist, abstract base and settle for pragmatism.

You are an ideologue who has no power and thus you can be a fundamentalist - fighting in the confines in which you can exert some influence but prayerfully hoping that you don't run into anyone who DOESN'T GIVE A DAMN about working within a system to change it via the standard machinations to do so.

I wonder if OBAMA changed or if YOU were proven ignorant about your knowledge of him?
If elected - do you really think that this will be the last of your disappointments with him?

Just think - IF he believed as you do on everything.....there is no chance in hell that he would be elected to represent the entire set of American people.

Constructive Feedback said...

Field-Negro - though I strongly disagree with just about all of the METHODOLOGIES that you use to achieve what are our COMMON GOALS - I have to give you praise for being consistent with your posting policy. The one's calling for you to hit the delete button on my posts are some of the main one's pointing out the government's trampling of speech. If you want to talk about irony - start right there.

[quote]Havng him post his vacuous illogical and anserine comments only helps to prove my theory about these new money conservative Negroes.[/quote]

Field-Negro - the next time you see a "vacuous illogical and anserine" comment of mine.....please high light it for me and then PICK IT A PART.

I keep hearing from certain leftists that they have "kicked my butt" in debates in various blogs but as I look at my body and mind....not a scratch.


[quote] So out of touch and clueless about what is really happening in the world. Talking about the deaths in Philly from the basement of his suburban rancher... and being glad to be so far far away from these mean streets. Must be nice.[/quote]

This is a laughable position Field-Negro. Might I translate what you have said?
YOU, like ME are keeping track of the murderous behavior that is taking place on the streets of Philly, DC, Baltimore, Detroit and many other Democratically controlled cities across America. Your reference to my "suburban living" appears to call upon ME to DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT rather than talk about it!

But wait Field-Negro - while you find time to eviscerate the Black conservative....who has no credibility within the Black community - you seem to be loathed to attack in kind the THUGS who are actually killing Black folks and the like-minded Negros like you who are raising these kids to commit community genocide.

It is clear to me that you get off on attacking your ideological enemies more than the people who do the most physical damage of having your Democratic Utopia actually EXPRESSED in these large cities.

I have told you on nearly every post - the WORST possible circumstance for you all to be in is in an environment where YOUR IDEOLOGY is the prevailing one. With "non-judgmentalism", "abstract-liberalism", focus on the GOVERNMENT while the PEOPLE who need management and rebuke are taken up as your victims, SCHOOLS that are run by your allies in the teachers unions and with the LAST CONSERVATIVE TO STAND AGAINST YOU having closed the door behind as he has exited......YOU HAVE CONTROL OF THE STEERING WHEEL. There is not an agency in the world who will insure you.

[quote]
This clown accuses me of not having my feet to the fire here in the city, when nothing could be farther from the truth. Trust me [un]constructive....I have done more than my share of giving back with time and money to the causes that really matter[/quote]

You know Field-Negro.....after hearing this type of claim thrown up for years and knowing its EFFECTIVENESS at neutralizing the criticisms of like-minded people as to the question of IF YOU ARE DOING SOMETHING.....I have come up with a brand new challenge to your LIST of "giving back":


IS IT ACTUALLY WORKING???????


You see Field-Negro some people are easily appeased. They WANT to agree with you before you even tell them what you are doing. Thus anything that you list will meet their approval.

In the past I talked about the need to FULLY QUALIFY the claims that you and others make with respect their COMPREHENSIVENESS, PROPORTIONALITY AND in the end their EFFECTIVENESS.

You see Field-Negro - I could leave my wife and kids right now and go to become a 24 hour a day volunteer at the local food bank, handing out nutrition to the long line of people who show up routinely at 7am, 12noon and 6pm like clockwork. I assure you that I would win a prize in YOUR heart for being dedicated per what I have given up.

But is this the real framework to measure the EFFECTIVENESS of my response Field-Negro? If the number of otherwise able bodied men DOUBLE in my foodline and I work twice as hard dishing out soup - am I really SOLVING the problem or just insuring that they live for another day?

The COMPREHENSIVENESS of my work is limited - I am but a ladle scooping soup. Instead these men need to have many of the assumptions that they were raised on CHANGED so that they can be channeled into productive pathways in society (Of course they are all there due to RACISM if they are Black or structural imbalances if they are White....in your mind but we'll address that later).

The bottom line of it is, Field-Negro - I am really not impressed with your WORK ON BEHALF OF THESE PEOPLE. To allow them to live another day is not yeoman's work. I challenge you to start WORKING WITH THEM, correcting that WITHIN THEM which has many of them unable to interact with productive society and be better for it.

This type of self-actualization goes strongly against the centralized planning model that is favored by many who are infected by the "ideological river blindness" that you suffer from. The thought of STRENGTH AT THE PERIPHERY where DISCIPLINE is maintained toward a given end is counter to your libertine ways.

IS IT WORKING Field-Negro?
This is not a call for you to give up what you are doing. This is only a call for you to switch from your IDEOLOGICAL-FUNDAMENTALISM over to a commitment toward EFFECTIVE OUTCOMES and the END GOAL.

Are you up to it is the question.

JelissaMone said...

ugh. child rapists should die.

Whitney B. said...

Constructive Feedback,

Got you confused with someone else. Excuse me, but I will not apologize for that. As for your reaction to me, oh well. Thanks for the info on goat's head soup. We made moose head soup in Alaska, in the villages, for pot latches, which is Alaskan for pot luck. Not as good because the spices weren't right. Native Alaskans tend to cook bland food, but then again, I'm a pepper person, preferably green or red and hot as hell.

As for your views, I still don't agree with you, but that is what makes reading all of this so interesting. I agree to disagree.

As for being a responsible married father, isn't that what you're supposed to be?

Whitney B. said...

Constructive Feedback,

And, another thing, you are allowing way too much space in your head for rebuts on what you say, especially in this little old white woman's case. After all, what are we, but your enemy. At least that's the feeling I get.

At least I don't differentiate amongst folks. Yeah, if you want to think I am a wingnut, go ahead, but I will be the first one up there to speak up for you or anyone else who wants to express their opinion! Even when I disagree.

field negro said...

"IS IT WORKING Field-Negro?"

YES!

Whitney B. said...

Field,

Good on you!

Respectfully,
Whit

Kit (Keep It Trill) said...

I agree with you on this one 100%. My reasoning might be a tad different. Remember the 17 year old black boy arrested for having oral sex done to him at a party by a 15 year old white girl? One of the reasons he sat in jail was they charged him as a friggin' child molester. This craziness gets played out in states and hits all the races. Wanna kill them too? No problem!

I agree, it's nuts. A very long sentence or life is the perfect solution for the real monsters.

And yeah, Obama is beginning to feel like Chinese water torture to me also. I still support him at this time, but I'm looking at him through narrowed eyes and if it gets too much worse, I'm wondering if I'll pull the lever for him on Election Day. I'm praying he won't screw up, because I really want to be part of the history making. I just don't want to regret it four years from now.

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