Philly is a city that is full of history and traditions. And one of Philly's most storied traditions is the rowing spectacle known as the Dad Vail Regatta. It is an annual rowing competition between colleges that attract the very bluest of blue bloods among us. Needles to say it is very white.
Recently Philly lost the event and fifty years of tradition to the tony New Jersey community of Rumson. Poor Mayor Nutter didn't see it coming, and he has been taking a lot of heat for it ever since. So now the hand wringing and pontification has begun. One African American columnist has summed up the feelings of black folks in this city who want to see the Regatta come back, but in a more racially diverse form.
"It seems organizers are mulling the possibility of bringing the Dad Vail Regatta back to Philadelphia in 2011. This after dumping the city for deep-pockets Rumson, N.J., for the 2010 regatta.
What's a 50-plus-year relationship got to do with it?
I'm just saying Dad Vail sounds like a two-timing boyfriend.
Everyone, it seems, is all up in oars and blaming Mayor Nutter for not fighting to keep the marriage gliding - even though the Dad Vail broke it off and found another sugar daddy without the city even knowing. And all for money, of course.
Rejection hurts. After all, the Dad Vail's prestige draws more than 125 elite college crew teams. Not to mention that the cash-strapped city could sure use the millions in revenue that 100,000 rowing fans are sure to toss around...
...Well, it hurts for some people. Of course, we always take back misbehaving boyfriends, but if the city had any foresight, it would shoot for a better version.
One that's a lot more representative.
Especially as our cash-strapped city tries to decide what events to fund, I'm not sure I'd put money into a public event that - unintentionally or not - has become a private endeavor.
The Dad Vail would mean a lot more than just a nerve-racking traffic hassle if it belonged to everyone.
No diversity. The cry for diversity along Boathouse Row has been ongoing for years now." [Link]
"Diversity"? Why? Black folks, can we talk? Why is it that you want to be included in everything that white folks do? Seriously, what the hell is that all about?
There are just certain things that we don't do or enjoy as a race. (I am, of course, speaking in generalities, so please save your comments about all the times you went skiing with your uncle Leroy. ) And as far as I am concerned, that's cool. White folks love to bungee jump and sky dive. Black folks like to watch a nice kung fu movie or play some dominoes. White folks like to water ski and scuba dive; black folks like to jet-ski and play frisbee in the sand. White folks like to ski, black folks like to sit in the ski lodge and talk shit. And on it goes. We have differences, and there is nothing wrong with that.
When events such as the Dad Vail Regatta go down and it's all lily white, there is no harm no foul as far as I am concerned. They spend money in the city and everyone benefits. I don't hear white folks screaming to be a part of the Greek Picnic. Why? Well I am guessing that they understand that it's an African American event, and there is no need to demand inclusion.
Not -some of-you black folks. If the white man is doing it, you want in. Stop it! As long as they are not saying you can't participate even if you wanted to, it's cool. Leave them alone to have their fun.
You Negroes can find other things to do.
BTW, please don't confuse my stance on this issue with my 12% rule. One is dealing with
an organized pre- planned gathering. The other deals with spontaneous happenings or events that are open to the general public. (Such as the movies which is what I use it for.) I just wanted to get that out of the way to preempt the field is a hypocrite comments.
Oh, and before I go; remember that story about Lincoln University trying to make classes on weight loss mandatory for graduation? Well it seems that they have changed their minds. There is nothing like a little added pressure from the overweight lobby to make "the man" cave...let me stop.
66 comments:
I wish Philly would act like it is a world class city, instead of the petty little townships it once was.
Wow am I first!!!!!????Seriously Field, for someone who gets his panties in a wad over anything that can remotely have a racial angle (Whats the deal with "White" Pizza??? Call Domino's and just try and order an "African American" Pizza) you sound more like David Duke than David Duke...
I'm Whiter than Boomer Essiason and Heidi Klum's love child, but I LOVE playin Dominos, Kung Fu Movies, and Knockin up 67 Hoes with my 17 inch Trouser Anaconda...
OK, just kidding about the last one, say it loud, I had a Vasectomy, and I'm Proud...
Y'all can take over the world after I'm gone....
Seriously, its like me sayin you like Watermelon, Fried Chicken, Loose Shoes, just cause you're a Spook.
There's a Jigaboo I know named Clarence, and get this, he likes COUNTRY MUSIC, and I don't mean the fake kind, I mean the REAL kind, like George Jones, and Chet Atkins...
And don't forget, tomorrows Slap a Jap, I mean Pearl Harbor day...
Frank
You are right Field; diversity in rowing is not a big deal. However, there areas that need to be looked at in terms of diversity that i hear few people mention. One of the biggest ones is the field of science. There are multiple fields of natural, physical, and theoretical science where virtually no black Phd holders are produced. Now that is a big problem, not some damn rowing event.
AMEN Anon 9:08 pm. Amen!
Hathor, the city is still world class, but unfortunately, many of the people still have a "petty little township" mentality.
I don't see the necessity of the inclusion of blacks rowing a boat. But I do see the necessity of blacks and other minorities who are journalism students to get adequate stories such as that other group (which predominates the media but no one dare say its name). Check out C-Span some mornings, you can tell these so called reporters are straight out of college. They report on the Congressional Record, Wall Street, geopolitics, etc. I have yet to see one Asian, Latino, black young student get such an opportunity on C-Span.
field, two words for you: jamaican bobsledders.
Err no white people at a "Greek" picnic...
Maybe the folks who organize the Odundi festival can demand equal treatment.... Odundi attracts a large group, and frankly a more diverse group of folks every summer... and they have been told their funds are cut, too....plus the food is fantastic and celebration is way more fun.
One of the biggest ones is the field of science. There are multiple fields of natural, physical, and theoretical science where virtually no black Phd holders are produced. Now that is a big problem, not some damn rowing event.
Yeah, a good place to start might be to see if the black high school dropout rate could be cut in half, which would make it the same as the white dropout rate. It would also help to close the math gap.
The gap was lowest in 1990 hmmm
Oh and Whites need to catch up to Asians. :/
"Err no white people at a "Greek" picnic..."
A wise guy. :)
"field, two words for you: jamaican bobsledders."
And another one.:)
Yes Jody, the Odundi festival is off the hook. I haven't been in a few years, but i do remember lots of white folks getting their mingle on.
Exceptions to the achievement gap exist. Schools that are majority black, even poor, can perform well above national norms, with Davidson Magnet School[citation needed] in Augusta, Georgia being a prominent example. Another school with remarkable gains for students of color is Amistad Academy in New Haven,Connecticut. All of the aforementioned schools generally offer more rigorous, traditional modes of instruction, including Direct Instruction. Direction Instruction was found to be the single most effective pedagogical method for raising the skill levels of inner-city students (Project Follow Through). [1] High performing Black schools are not unique to the twentieth century. In Washington, DC in the late 19th century, a predominantly low income Black school performed higher than three White schools in yearly testing. This trend continued until the mid 20th century, and during that time the M Street School exceeded national norms on standardized tests. [2]
Social researchers Carl L. Bankston III and Stephen J. Caldas have argued that the achievement gap, rather than overt racism, is the main source of continuing school segregation in the United States. In their books, A Troubled Dream: The Promise and Failure of School Desegregation in Louisiana [3] (2002) and Forced to Fail: The Paradox of School Desegregation [4] (2005), they maintain that students benefit academically from going to school with relatively high-achieving schoolmates and are academically disadvantaged when they have relatively low-achieving schoolmates. Therefore, a racial gap in achievement means that even parents without overt racial prejudices tend to avoid sending their children to schools with large percentages of minority students.
Heres that school:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunbar_High_School_%28Washington,_D.C.%29
From the school wiki, an interesting tidbit and probably a good explanation for their success in the aforementioned article:
"Its faculty was paid well by the standards of the time, earning parity pay to Washington's white school teachers because they were federal employees. It also boasted a remarkably high number of graduates who went on to higher education, and a generally successful student body."
Oh and Whites need to catch up to Asians. :/
No shit. All the Asians taking the GMAT (business school test) have raised the math curve like you wouldn't believe.
~
There are a significant number of unused varsity college and university rowing / crew scholarships for female rowers. Male rowing is usually a club sport at the university level.
Often, a C average is all that is needed for a full ride scholarship; but we wouldn't want any of those
extra-heavy-duty, juicy-booty Philadelphia high school future baby mamas to start acting white and commence rowing, would we feld, er uh, field.
As per usual field, your ignorance underwhelms me.
`
FN - I concur about the rowing issue...who gives a sh*t about rowing? Let 'em row...as long as the ENTIRE city gets the reveune.
And on the Lincoln thing...HBCU's (most) need to rethink their stance on education and how to impart it. The competing cost of education makes alot of the HBCU's obsolete. What Lincoln should have done was offer the class with no explanation...those that want to take it can and those that don't, won't. Had that happened (like they do in white colleges and universities) they would have had students lining up for the class. Sometimes it's about delivery. (Now whut iz we gon do 'bout dese heah boyz n da ATL dressin dey selves up lak de girlz n gon ta classes...?????) Peace.
~agape2010~
I don't even know if WE are really interested in what the tighty whitey's are doing or we just dont know how to remain relevent without them...Good Post though!
Sincerely,
Go
"As per usual field, your ignorance underwhelms me."
NSangoma, I am guessing that just waking up in the morning "underwhelms" you as well.
Just a guess. ;)
"And on the Lincoln thing...HBCU's (most) need to rethink their stance on education and how to impart it. The competing cost of education makes alot of the HBCU's obsolete."
Agape...I couldn't agree with you more. There are more Govs like Haley Barbour in Mississippi who are just dying to cut their funding.
W, I swear, I might not always agree with you, but you always come with a ton of artillery to back up your positions.
"No shit. All the Asians taking the GMAT (business school test) have raised the math curve like you wouldn't believe."
Notice how white racists fall all over themselves praising Asians.
You see, there's not a whole lot of 'em, they're not real active politically and the grinders of the world don't see them as a real threat.
So they love to use them as the "model minority" bludgeon to bop black folks over the head with.
Usher was pretty cool on Xtreme Home Maker. Totally deserves the award.
Uptownsteve:
I don't think Grinder was necessarily praising Asians, but merely recognizing reality and the gap between Asian scores and White scores.
There's no need to praise Asians for being smarter than whites, blacks, or Latinos; their performance on standardized tests, IQ tests, and in school, and the workplace does that all by itself.
The analogy to the two-timing boyfriend dumping the girl friend is backwards. Philadelphia isn't the loyal girlfriend - Philly is the BOYFRIEND. For 50 years a bunch of people (the neighbors of the couple) put on a regatta that lots of people liked to come to. Over the years, the happy couple drifted apart, until all the Boyfriend would do was demand loans from the neighbors and berate the Wife for not doing "more" - but never defining what "more" was. this was a classic, dysfunctional relationship. The Neighbors began to complain, and - despite their love or the wife, advised her to get out of her abusive relationship. After finally realizing the futility of the situation - after all the Boyfriend ignored the neighbors and her entreaties to back off and be more supportive - the wife has left town - and will very likely not be back.
"There's no need to praise Asians for being smarter than whites, blacks, or Latinos; their performance on standardized tests, IQ tests, and in school, and the workplace does that all by itself."
Ohhhh snappp! Thats racist!
Sometimes the truth is racist I guess...
not the truth..just you.
Alright, please give some evidence that would prove my statement at 12:05 incorrect. I simply said that Asians do better in school, the workplace, on standardized tests, and on IQ tests. That's not even a controversial statement. It's the truth.
I have been to Philly only once and that was a New Year's weekend about 25 years ago.
I watched something called the "Mummers Parade" with my chin on the ground. I mean blackface? White guys dressed up in ooga-booga jungle garb? (That picture of Obama as a witchdoctor that the teabaggers use is exactly it.)
Do they still do that shit?
I couldn't believe it then...please tell me that's all gone now.
Back in the early 70s nobody at the college I attended in rural Appalachia was rich, but we did have a rowing team and a black guy member of that team.
Sure, anecdotal it may be, but I'm just sayin. . .
Kwanzaa??? The sooner we intergrate the faster racism will be a thing of the past. 40+ yrs & folks still be complainin.....
Anonymous,
How do Asians "do better" in the workplace?
How do Asians "do better" in the workplace?
They have higher representation, in comparison to their population size, in critical fields like science and engineering.
First, to all the definders of Asian folks, explain why I had one who always wanted to copy my work in high school. Believe me: they are not a monolithic block of progress.
Second, I'll say that if it's a private event, just let it go. I could understand if it was an event open to the public, but if a bunch of rich guys want to see people race in boats, let them. If they refuse to sell you a ticket, I could understand, but let them have it.
@W
"In Washington, DC in the late 19th century, a predominantly low income Black school performed higher than three White schools in yearly testing. This trend continued until the mid 20th century, and during that time the M Street School exceeded national norms on standardized tests. [2]"
FYI I also read the Wiki entry you referenced, and I still have some issues with your comment. The Dunbar/M Street School did not have a mostly low-income student body at all! The majority of the students there came from the upper classes of Black Washington. Hell, Blacks from other states would send their kids to DC, and have them live in a boarding house, just to go to that school! Broke folks couldn’t do that!
The Dunbar/M Street School has always been accused of being class and color conscious. And, as a result, only "certain" folks could attend this school. How do I know this? I’m a native Washingtonian who’s also a historian, and several folks in my family attended that school.
So, yes as a predominately Black public school, Dunbar/M Street School did break many records; they were not representative of the entire race, so we should not look at this case out of its proper context. It does us a disservice.
L
"They have higher representation, in comparison to their population size, in critical fields like science and engineering."
That's a totally different issue than "doing better in the workplace."
Asians tend to focus on the science and engineeting disciplines.
Doesn't mean they would be better attorneys, salesmen, or entrepeneurs.
You're determined to establish a racial heirarchy, aren't you?
And we all know who you're gonna place at the bottom.
Direct instruction has showed limited success in primary grades ONLY! The program is good for decoding words. Beyond 2nd grade it's useless and others like it as well. The gains are quite modest. The two schools you cite as wonderful are not your average "urban" schools. Schools such as these are filled with black students, but usually with those of concerned and motivated parents, albeit poor ones. Parents must agree to longer school days, spending x amount of time in the classroom and helping with homework. Therefore, they are not models of success based upon poor, urban black kids. They are successful as any school is with parents who are required to step up. Period.
Furthermore, Davidson in GA has a strict admission policy (based on grades etc.). Not your average public school once again.
If the white man is doing it, you want in. Stop it! As long as they are not saying you can't participate even if you wanted to, it's cool. Leave them alone to have their fun.
True, I don't think we need to waste time and throw our precious selfs out to people who won't accept us no matter what...we don't need to look to other ethnicities and cultures for verification of the fact that we are equal and to be accepted and identified as such...
In this particular case, we have to understand that when most white people meet a person of color who doesn't match the stereotypes in their minds and hearts about that kind of person of color, they often assume that the person is "covering." Or "acting white." anyway.
It goes back to the disscussion of why blacks are still wading in this recession...failure and lack of desire to intergrate...
there are some whites that enjoy openly segregated activities ...strictly for fear of losing their culture and identity taking place in their minds
..we don't have to look for verification and acceptance beyond what is within. Besides we know how to take something of leisure and importance to us like putting poetry to music and rhythm and make it a world wide trend...(hip-hop)
ps. mad props to the Italian authorities for putting to justice another Amerrykkkan not wanting to abide by the laws of another counrty despite the biased amerrykkkan MSM for trying to trivialize the ironclad evidence revealed that lead to the just verdict by alloting her family more airtime than the victims family in an effort to maintain the false and vain image of Amerrykkkan exceptionalism! Speaking of biased amerrykkkan MSM I'm looking forward to the Olbermann/Maddow spin..i mean report on this...if any at all.
Sorry Amerrykkkan MSM but the facade of white Amerrykkkan privlege abroad you've always projected is on its last leg...now carry on with the exceptionalism and supremacy act while you can because you're pissed Italy didn't sentence the black guy in her place, like the Amerrrykkkan justice system would have most likely done!
"FYI I also read the Wiki entry you referenced, and I still have some issues with your comment. The Dunbar/M Street School did not have a mostly low-income student body at all! The majority of the students there came from the upper classes of Black Washington. Hell, Blacks from other states would send their kids to DC, and have them live in a boarding house, just to go to that school! Broke folks couldn’t do that!
The Dunbar/M Street School has always been accused of being class and color conscious. And, as a result, only "certain" folks could attend this school. How do I know this? I’m a native Washingtonian who’s also a historian, and several folks in my family attended that school.
So, yes as a predominately Black public school, Dunbar/M Street School did break many records; they were not representative of the entire race, so we should not look at this case out of its proper context. It does us a disservice."
My comment was entirely pointed to people who put forth the whole "pull yourself up using your own bootstraps" or whatever aka the lack of black initiative retort so commonly used.
What I was trying to say is given good paid teachers and the advantages many whites had blacks performed as well as or even outperformed their peers. Which obviously isn't news to anybody but I like just seeing examples of it.
And that's really the only context I was looking at it in.
Krystlxlyte said "...In this particular case, we have to understand that when most white people meet a person of color who doesn't match the stereotypes in their minds and hearts about that kind of person of color, they often assume that the person is "covering." Or "acting white." anyway."
What is "white" culture? What is "black" culture? (No I do not want a definition of "black ghetto" culture? What is mainstream? When a subculture comes up with something that is adopted by the mainstream or globally is it still a subculture thing? (like hip-hop? or jazz or you name your music?)
If the family down the street lives and works where I live and work and has their kiddie ride up the cul-de-sac on their Big Wheel is that "covering" or acting "white." Is there an integrated American culture? or is one even possible? or appropriate?
If you are doing what I consider "normal" why would I be afraid that I was losing my culture? my identity? My skin/color is neither my culture nor my identity nor is it yours?
Do people of African-American descent really want to integrate in that term? Don't they just want to get on with their lives in whatever fashion they desire without any stupid nonsensical barriers? When faced with the so subtle racist comments, sneers innuendos etc does a person think integration? or what? Segregation is a real, but not a legal situation. Legally we are integrated. I am sure that is such a "comfort" to people of color dealing with the reality.
Irish or Scottish games tend to look segregated by culture but it appears by color I guess anyone could go and enjoy? (I would just love to see the field hands toss a caber; would be very good at it.)
Apologies for both confusion and ignorance.
"have been to Philly only once and that was a New Year's weekend about 25 years ago.
I watched something called the "Mummers Parade" with my chin on the ground. I mean couldn't believe it blackface?..."please tell me that's all gone now.
Well.....sort of...
I fail to see the attraction of rowing, unless one is training to be a galley slave. Come to think of it, most rowers I know probably would like to be locked up at sea with a bunch of other half naked men.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say free money for school?
Lady-Cracker, those are thoughful and serious questions, maybe one of these smart field hands can answer it for you.
"Do people of African-American descent really want to integrate in that term? Don't they just want to get on with their lives in whatever fashion they desire without any stupid nonsensical barriers?"
I do believe that statement is true. The problem is that some folks in the majority population want to set up those "barriers" for us. Human beings should be free to do whatever they want, I agree. But some groups,based on culture, socialization, or whatever, tend to enjoy certain things, while others don't.
"If the family down the street lives and works where I live and work and has their kiddie ride up the cul-de-sac on their Big Wheel is that "covering" or acting "white."'
No, it's called a kid enjoying a Big Wheel, and a family working every day to pay their mortgage, take care of the kid on the Big Wheel, and live the A-merry-can dream. They are no different from anyone else.
Lola and cardiss, thanks for the 411 on those schools.
krystalxlyte, no one would ever mistake you for a house slave. :)
Finally FIELD NEGRO! that's it, call us OUT! and yes, why do our people want to all way's be up under WHITE FOLK'S! remember BLACK FOLK'S, WHITE FOLK'S did NOT ask to MINGLE with us, we FORCED them too! the CIVIL RIGHT'S BILL was one thing, but, our PEOPLE just had to buy HOME'S in WHITE NEIGHBORHOOD'S! after they made it PLAIN, they did NOT want us THERE!
Black's have a certain way of living, and that doe's not take away from who we are, as a people, as for me, I do not need to CLIMB a MOUNTAIN or JUMP from an Air Plane! as for those WHITE'S, that go MOUNTAIN CLIMBING, they alway's seem to get STUCK or fall to their DEATH! and look at the MESS they create, these people will challenge DEATH no matter what!
White folk's love to go HUNTING, well, they usually get LOST! and when they do, the entire COUNTRY has to go hunting for these CARELESS PEOPLE, and some end up getting half their face BIT OFF by a MOUNTAIN LION or a BEAR!!! so in the end, BLACK FOLK'S have COMMON SENSE!
White folk's could care less about ASIAN'S! but, they will use their so called (intelligence) to try and SHOW Black's in a Inferior light, who else do they have? they despise HISPANIC'S! look how they did SOTOMAYER!
ISEEISEE
Hmm noted cardiss...
But I think a parent's motivation and involvement in their kids future is pretty much required for any child to succeed. Except for a few rare cases I suppose.
And again I just saw that school from a link grinder posted about gaps. I'm not putting it forth as a typical representative sample of "average" urban schools. The only thing I was pointing out was whatever they were doing was working.
And I would think if I was pointing them out as "wonderful" example then that would implicitly mean that they aren't the "average" urban school.
I don't really want to look at average schools when trying to look at what makes the best the best.
"Schools such as these are filled with black students, but usually with those of concerned and motivated parents, albeit poor ones."
Yeah like above concerned and motivated parents are key to any child's success.
The parents bring the concern and motivation and the government steps up funding to the teachers and I think that would be a winning combination.
And back to Lola's point about the school attracting well to do black kids.
I would guess that the school first had to start excelling and shining before the more affluent families started concentrating their children in these schools.
After searching a while I wanted to see if there was any evidence that my guess was right. And if these site has any credibility then my guess was right ie: the poor children first put this school on the map of academic excellence, then later a middle class presence developed.
"When I first published this information in 1974, those few educators who responded at all dismissed the relevance of these findings by saying that these were "middle class" children and therefore their experience was not "relevant" to the education of low-income minority children. Those who said this had no factual data on the incomes or occupations of the parents of these children-- and I did.
"The problem, however, was not that these dismissive educators did not have evidence. The more fundamental problem was that they saw no need for evidence. According to their dogmas, children who did well on standardized tests were middle class. These children did well on such tests, therefore they were middle class."
"Lack of evidence is not the problem. There was evidence on the occupations of the parents of the children at this school as far back in the early 1890s. As of academic year 1892-93, there were 83 known occupations of the parents of the children attending The M Street School. Of these occupations, 51 were laborers and one was a doctor.4 That doesn't sound very middle class to me.
Over the years, a significant black middle class did develop in Washington and no doubt most of them sent their children to the M Street School or to Dunbar High School, as it was later called. But that is wholly different from saying that most of the children at that school came from middle-class homes.
During the later period, for which I collected data, there were far more children whose mothers were maids than there were whose fathers were doctors. For many years, there was only one academic high school for blacks in the District of Columbia and, as late as 1948, one-third of all black youngsters attending high school in Washington attended Dunbar High School. So this was not a "selective" school in the sense in which we normally use that term-- there were no tests to take to get in, for example-- even though there was undoubtedly self-selection in the sense that students who were serious went to Dunbar and those who were not had other places where they could while away their time, without having to meet high academic standards. (A vocational high school for blacks was opened in Washington in 1902).5
A spot check of attendance records and tardiness records showed that The M Street School at the turn of the century and Dunbar High School at mid-century had less absenteeism and less tardiness than the white high schools in the District of Columbia at those times. The school had a tradition of being serious, going back to its founders and early principals.
Thus dismissing its success as a product of upper class blacks is unfair if this site is in the least bit credible.
Credit:
http://www.tsowell.com/speducat.html
And something I first missed in reading the wiki article is this tidbit:
Student body
During the 2004-2005 school year, Dunbar had 1500 students [1].
* 98% were African-American
* 1% was Hispanic
* Less than 1% were Asian
* Less than 1% were Native American
* Less than 1% were White
46% of students qualified for free or reduced lunch.
46%!? So half of the student body qualifies for free or reduced lunch! And they are mostly from the upper class of Washington? What do you consider upper class?
See now field, I know you're being a bit tongue in cheek but you've gone and hit my class button. Just because rowing is majority and/or historically 'white' doesn't make it a white man's event. Rowing is white because of class disparities. Rich whites go to Ivies and Ivies row. However, the average white person who doesn't live in the NE has probably never seen even one rowing competition. Even whites in the NE, who aren't of the brahmin class, likely have no interest in the sport because just like blacks they've had no access. So we've got an 'all-white' event where maybe 1% of whites local to the area care about it. Since there are more whites than blacks even if 5% of the black population is interested it's still going to be a 'white' event. For all we know there may be a greater percentage of the overall American black population interested in rowing than the overall percentage of American white folks.
Given the regional nature, black population concentrations in cities, Philly's history and demographics and the fact that very few in the white population overall care it really wouldn't be surprising if a greater percentage of black folks were more interested in rowing than the percentage of white folks.
Now in such a scenario, why shouldn't black folks want to be included? ;)
Seriously though, most of the examples you list are issues of class and/or regional culture rather than race. Things often defined as quintessentially white in our culture (golf, rowing, tennis, etc.) are things associated with white male power and money. Diversity is important because of access and the fact that these events represent classes or rather who hasn't made it. If it continues to be white and male you can be sure that people of color and women haven't broken through. And to pick up the point on access, we all know business is done at the clubs and people of color and women being left out are being left out of more than just a fancy restaurant and pool.
--j
I live in the philly area work downtown and i could care less if the vail dad regatta stays or goes. it doesnt affect me one way or another.
1 race = human
color is not a race
I don't think Grinder was necessarily praising Asians, but merely recognizing reality and the gap between Asian scores and White scores.
Exactly. I took the GMAT 25 years ago and scored in the 88th percentile for math. That was before the Asian influx. Today, my score would put me in the high-50s.
Question is how to react. We know how blacks in South Philly have handled it: By beating up Asian students because they are jealous of people who are smarter and work harder than they do.
In 20 years, those thugs will be lucky to have jobs cleaning the offices where their classmates will work. Let's hope that whites aren't as stupid and violent.
Take a look at California. Asians are increasingly running the new high-tech firms. What are CA's blacks known for these days?
+Brother Field...you are sooo right about the topic. Would be nice for my people to "do" all facets of the American experiance. But- me being my "racial self", would be delighted if we were competitive in those "other" sports. I see in America most ethnic group have a special niche in our society. I contend that the medical field is a prime area for African Americans to instantly gain a economic base. As a start- we can be at a level that would have an instant impact. I am talking about family doctors, nurses ,nurse's aides and home care providers. I say this because very few people are willing to clean, feed and do personal care to an aging and mentally exhausted population. The ME generation have not the up-close human skills needed to provide this care. This is not a knock- it just is. An example is communicating by sooo many ways other than face-to-face. Which I know cause a lot of faulty interactions in person. Just like someone want to knock my beliefs on this forum where the essence of the conversation is usually lost. Please, naysayers don't crack because I have not the emotional revenue to respond....
Now that you've mentioned it, what do the white fraternities do during Spring Break?
Oh, as for the Dad Vail Regatta, I know losing it to another city, especially New Jersey has to hurt after fifty-four years. And countless numbers of dollars.
It will probably return in 2011, though.
Little old white lady here.
Field, I get it about you & snow sports. I mean, if I'd grown up on a tropical island I would kind of give the cold-weather outdoor sports a pass, too.
But, you know, there are plenty of black ski clubs, not to mention the National Brotherhood of Skiers (I think they have broadened their mission to all winter sports.)
If you ski in Utah, you don't see so many black folks. On the other hand, if you ski at the resorts relatively near Denver (for example) -- the percentage is a lot higher. Maybe not yet 10% or 12%.
And don't overlook http://www.africanamericanoutdoors.com/
And how about the Universal sailing club? No, it isn't crew or a rowing club, but isn't sailing a "white" sport?
Dad Vail is great college sporting event, but it's second tier in rowing if one considers the programs that don't participate. It'll be good for Jersey's north shore IF the organizers can handle the details & crowd on a waterway hasn't hosted an event of this size. That remains to be seen.
FN- you bitched in your sidebar about "the black guy" getting 30 years while Amanda Knox getting 25 1) He was on probation and had a long history of crime (in Italy, like the U.S committing crime while on probabtion will get you a longer sentence 2) he was convicted of sexual assault in addition to murder since, by his own admission he ahd sex with her minutes before she was murdered 3) There is a fuck of a lot more evidence against him than the other two.
He should have gotten a lot more than 5 years longer than her or her bf.
Why don't Mumia supporters to task for defending that guilty piece of crap while not defending Amanda? There is far more evidence against him.... maybe Mumia supporters are racist.... hmmm
this is cracking me up. I viewed the loss of th Dad Vail as a loss for the city and cities that have no money to do anything. the only racial compotent is that it has come to there is no money for anything period.
As to the race being more diverse, this guy clearly doesn't go and watch. I've seen the crews be lily white and become more integrated and back to a darker shade of white. The most infamous was the crew from Syracuse who came down w/ the Bo don't know crew sweats
Lady Cracker, The dictionary term for culture is: the customary beliefs, social forms, and material traits of a racial, religious, or social group..when that definition is applied to Blacks/whites whom ever there ensues the definition of that particular race's culture. The ghetto perception you instinctively mentioned is what is classified as a stereotype..two different things...living in Amerrykkka all my life, I come to understand that white culture is based upon what isn't rather that what is..
its hard to define since it is percieved that white culture is the default culture of the world (just look around TV, Magazines, Radio..)and those who identify and share common ideas and beliefs and resemble each other are apart of that culture.
When a subculture comes up with something that is adopted by the mainstream or globally is it still a subculture thing?
Well..consider the reason for why in (i.e. Japan) the hip hop culture is coined as a subculture..same for other genres of music i.e. punk rock ect..
If the family down the street lives and works where I live and work and has their kiddie ride up the cul-de-sac on their Big Wheel is that "covering" or acting "white."
Not necessarily..but would you be shocked to one day out of the blue see him rolling on his big wheel with rims, sound system and a gold chain...I know of several white people that wouldn't..again..this is just from my experience..
what i meant when in that particular case when some whites see anything other than the stereotypes of a minority its usually linked with the suspicion that theres some alternate persona behind the black person's exterior (being ghetto) without there necessarily being one..
I know of some white folk that if they didn't see us walking down the street sans weave the long nails huge hoop earrings that would fufill the given stereotypes...there would be a good chance that we'd be coined as 'different from the others'
we wear the mask and are faced with the pressure to look act a certain way on a daily basis..youtube Wanda Sykes "the real Michelle Obama."
If you are doing what I consider "normal" why would I be afraid that I was losing my culture? my identity? My skin/color is neither my culture nor my identity nor is it yours?
It depends on what you consider "normal" (I don't mean to beat this dead horse) but consider when T. Woods when he first came on the scene..what the racial climate was like..not many blacks were into golf...chicken and collard greens (that some people like to associate us with) were threating to take over the course..why did they feel this way?
In amerrrykkka unfortunately, my skin color does categorize me to a certain culture/identity..I think you have the right idea that it shouldn't but I have found out that if you are a woman of color who does not use the stereotypical manner of self-expression-it can cause your problems period.
krystalxlyte, no one would ever mistake you for a house slave. :)
ok yeah i know..maybe i have been a little too vocal of late as my recent and sudden suspension..i mean vacation has allwed me to do so but thats only because my boss (who is a equal opportunity patronizer to the minorities) has been having me work 60 hrs at the lab for the past month and aint even puttin that OT on my check and THEN wanted me to do some work at the last minute and calling me while I'm off trying to sort out the Christmas tension that makes its way into the house via bills..he ended up apologizing after I had some words with him..but I apologize for being a opeve
you think if by telling him when it comes to my money and family i don't giva fk would be pushing it?<
^apologize for being an open vent.. lol!
Guess what? The vast majority of white people find rowing ridiculous too.
Krystalxlyte, thank you for the effort of addressing some of my questions. I am sorry that it took me so long to get back. It is also a pity I cannot seem to explain what I am trying to ask.
I object to using color as a race. There is ust one race of people. However, racisim is alive and well, even if based on totally false assumptions, science, what have you.
You say have problems whan you are not acting stereotypically. Essentially the only contact that I have with people of color is in a working or shopping environment. Do we have a shared culture of middle classness? The dominant culture in this country is judeo-christian euro centric, with overlays of practically every other culture in the world. In many places in this country "poor" people aspire to the "middle" class and have adopted middle class values. Are "black middle" class values different from "white middle" class values? Should they be? I feel that ethnic differences should be cherished and celebrated and that values are not ethnic, but more universal.
I don't care for the loud mouthed gum popping of "trailer trash." Bet you don't either. Bet you don't like what Field refers to as "Shaniqua's" loud and pop either. Do we have a shared value that is common to our class? As people living in this country can we find enough common or human cultural ground to come together? We lose so much when we remain splintered and apart.
(I don't find rowing ridculous, I love using the rowing machine in the gym to warm up. It has been a long time since I have actually rowed a dingy and I have never done rowing as in those races.)
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